Utopia vs Mysphere 3.2 vs Susvara vs 1266 Phi TC

[M0N]

I think you’re really on the right track, other one that really seems up your alley is the viva egoista 845, I would personally actually prefer that over the wa33 stock, but the wa33 elite is a closer comparison for sure. I think it would really depend on what you want to focus on, both are cleaner leaning amps that are very technical with different focuses. The viva focuses a lot more on spatial recreation and stage than the wa33 elite does, it’s much more grand, spacious, and honestly just more impressive than the stage on the wa33 in most aspects, although the wa33 is more faithful to the recording/source and more accurate in placing things naturally, but it’s really hard to ignore the spatial focus of the 845. Dynamically the wa33 does a better job accuracy wise, but the 845 is just more dynamic to my ears but it’s perhaps a tad bit exaggerated there. Resolving power wise, the wa33 elite can pull a bit more resolution and lower level information and present it more faithfully imo, but the 845 isn’t a slouch either. I do personally like the better bite you get on the 845 where you get a bit more softness on the woo but really neither are what I’d consider soft. Tonal density is a weaker point of the 845 and a strength of the wa33, it’s going to be richer overall where the 845 will sound a bit more dry in comparison.

Oh what the hell I’ll just be lazy and do it this way (to be clear this is with the elite not reg)

Macrodetail/Surface Level Detail : Woo >= Viva (Viva is very clear in conveying things up front but the woo does that slightly better without calling as much attention to itself)
Microdetail/Low Level Detail : Woo > Viva (Woo can just pull more from the recording here)
Speed : Viva > Woo (Viva has crazy speed)
Separation : Viva >= Woo (Viva more separated although slightly more artificially than the woo)
Control & Grip : Viva > Woo (I do think the viva has heavier handed control over everything)
Impact & Slam : Viva > Woo (I do feel that the viva is less rounded and more punchy and more substantial sounding when things hit)
Midrange Texture : Woo > Viva (Woo can really pull a lot of texture quite well)
Bass Texture : Woo >= Viva (The viva is close but doesn’t quite pull as much or present it as well as the woo)
Treble Extension : Viva >= Woo (Viva feels like it goes a bit farther, although woo is more refined)
Bass Extension : Viva >= Woo (See above)
Microdynamics : Woo > Viva (The woo has a stronger focus on lower level volume changes)
Macrodynamics : Viva >= Woo (Woo almost there but can’t quite match the large swings the viva can pull off)
Background Blackness : Woo > Viva (Woo sounds more spatially absent)
Stage Width : Viva >> Woo (Viva just goes a whole lot farther and grander)
Stage Depth : Woo >= Viva (Woo can go a bit deeper but honestly the viva is still more impressive to me since it’s able to almost get there with a much more substantial stage size)
Stage Verticality : Viva >> Woo (Viva feels more holographic and involving here)
Stage Boundary : Woo >= Viva (Woo is more tightly defined and composed in stage)
Placement Accuracy : Woo > Viva (Woo feels more natural and realistic in placement)
Presentation Organicness : Woo >> Viva (See above)
Presentation Openness : Viva > Woo (Viva just feels more open and airy from a stage perspective)
Timbre : Woo >> Viva (Woo just does really well here, it’s presented more inorganically on the viva imo)
Tonality Organicness : Woo >> Viva (The woo leans more neutral but a very coherent and well weighted neutral, with tube swaps it can lean cleaner or a bit more warmth but still generally more balanced and convincing)
Tonal Density Quantity : Woo >> Viva (Woo just has more meat on the bone)
Tonal Density Quality : Woo > Viva (More accurate, viva not bad here though)
Smoothness : Woo >> Viva (Woo has better overall smoothness for sure)
Softness/Roundness : Woo >> Viva (The viva is a harder edged sound without getting harsh, woo def has a more roundness)
Liquidity : Woo > Viva (Woo feels more effortless overall)
Coherency : Woo >> Viva (Viva has some issues with slight midrange disjointedness and it’s more exaggerated aspects don’t help it here either, woo feels very complete)
Forwardness : Viva > Woo (Neither offensively forward but the viva is more in your face about things)
Energy & Incisiveness : Viva >> Woo (The viva offers a level of energy and directness that you just don’t get from the woo)
Forgivingness : Woo > Viva (Neither are all that forgiving but the woo is kinder to lesser sources and music)
Overall Treble : Woo >= Viva (While I think the viva is more extended and linear, I don’t think it’s as refined and nuanced as the woo treble)
Overall Midrange : Woo >> Viva (midrange is weird on the viva, it’s both rounded and sweet but overly technical, I really should change this but I think the midrange of the woo sounds more mature, that somewhat lack of coherency put me off from the viva when it came to midrange)
Overall Bass : Viva = Woo (While the woo is more organic here, I can’t help but love the amount of energy and control the viva has in the low end)
Overall Subbass : Viva > Woo (This one really is the viva doing quite well where the woo is just more polite and restrained here in comparison, but both still really good to be clear)

Basically, if you like stage, energy, explosiveness, and a more forward and in your face sound, go 845. If you like something a bit more composed, nuanced, refined, and balanced, go wa33

I will say the egoista is a bigger pain in the ass, it’s more expensive to tube roll (potentially, for the 845 at least), it’s less safe since you can somewhat easily blow your headphones if you aren’t careful when turning it on, runs hotter, and is more picky what goes into and out of it. But I don’t think that’s enough to put people off from wanting one, just something to note. Neither of the amps are what I’d consider low maintenance but the wa33 is more plug and play.

DAC wise running the bricasti, the m21 paired well with both, although I slightly preferred the viva pairing since it made the amp more composed and addressed some of the complaints about coherency and exaggratedness, added a bit more weight, and reduced intensity a bit without taking out what I liked about the amp. With the woo it’s good but more neutral and no nonsense, but no complaints with that pairing

I think generally I personally preferred the susvara with the wa33 elite and the 1266 with the 845, but that’s more if I wanted to double down on what the cans are good at, if I wanted to more try and compensate for what they didn’t have it would be the opposite, they were good on both but I really like the susvara on the wa33 for it’s nuance and refinement because they both do that well, and the 1266 on the 845 for it’s stage, energy, and directness because that’s what they both do well

I did own the 845 a lot longer than the wa33 elite if that says anything, but that’s likely because the 845 fit a better niche role in my collection of amps at the time where the wa33 was more an all rounder and I didn’t feel I needed that with what else I had on hand. Both top tier amps though

In terms of getting ahold of one, you are much more likely to find wa33 than you are 845 in the us, although 845 are actually a better value if you can find one since they drop more in value on the used market, but international shipping could quickly diminish that potential extra value

Tube wise, I do think there’s more tweak ability within the wa33 than there is the 845, the 845 is more something you pick and forget and the wa33 can be more subtly tweaked easily, responds better to different tube swaps, and there’s just more options for what you can swap in there for sure if you are that sort of person, but I’m not, I’ll just pick something I like and go with it

[Christof]

Interesting, I will have to look into the 845 more. Honestly the safety concerns are a little bit unnerving but I’ve learned to be more careful with amps recently (since my first Volot started smoking and had to be sent back) so it’s probably something I could deal with. Appreciate the in depth comparison of the two though.

[M0N]

To complicate things further, I think the aries cerat genus 845 sits inbetween them and takes the positivities of both and puts it into one amp. Although will likely be the most expensive and difficult to get ahold of option in the end, and the most picky in terms of pairing, I don’t know if I was a fan of the bricasti pairup with the AC. To be clear this is just for my preferences though, I can still see someone picking an elite or viva over the AC depending on what they wanted and what they were pairing with

[Littledrummerboy]

@M0N

it’s less safe since you can somewhat easily blow your headphones if you aren’t careful when turning it on

I think you had mentioned this before. However what’s the reason that It can blow up your headphones again? lol

[M0N]

@M0N

if you turn it on wrong it will shit itself (there’s a 3 way switch, middle is off, top is on, and bottom is warm up. To turn it on, you need to flip the amp down to warm up for I do it for 10 minutes, and then very quickly flip all the way up to on, if you linger in the middle it will shit itself so it needs to be one swift motion)

Basically this, if you turn it on wrong or are impatient it blows up, but really thought it’s not a problem once you know what to actually do and are careful. It’s also not going to have any protection if the dac feeding it puts out something too strong either, basically if there’s a fault it’s over. But really though it’s not that common or exclusive to viva either. The turn on process is just the thing that’s specific to them

[Rmsanger]

I heard someone mention that Aries Cerat is coming out with a new TOTL headphone amp. Have you heard this to be the case?

[M0N]

I frankly haven’t paid attention to that, but it wouldn’t surprise me if they did. I might pick one up if it seems compelling enough (although I’d need to sell off another amp to do it which will be hard to figure out which one)

[Polygonhell]

@Rmsanger

I heard someone mention that Aries Cerat is coming out with a new TOTL headphone amp. Have you heard this to be the case?

@Draaly has mentioned it a couple of time, might be interesting if it’s true.
It’s basically impossible to demo AC gear, there is one dealer in the US (in Texas near Austin) as far as I can tell, and I never see it used, though I’m sure said dealer moves used gear.

[Littledrummerboy]

Ah ok ok gotcha. Seems like you just need to know the know how and ur good. Reminds me of when I lived in a trailer and we used a boiler. Apparently there was a very particular way in which the boiler was replaced, when the trailer owner taught my brother how to do it he said it has to be done in a specific way otherwise it will blow up and i was like, I don’t know how I feel about that lol. However it seems like one of those things that you probably won’t ever do, still kinda scary to think about tho.

[Polygonhell]

@Littledrummerboy

However it seems like one of those things that you probably won’t ever do

FWIW it’s an amp Abyss won’t recommend because at least one owner destroyed their headphones.
Basically the amp requires you manually preheat the tubes, most other amps do this as a warm up cycle, usually with a muting relay, but on the Egoista you rotate the switch one way, wait 5 minutes then rotate it back through the off position all the way to on.
It’s not complicated, but if you turn it on without warming it up (or pause for an extended time in the off position), all bets are off.

[Littledrummerboy]

@Polygonhell

It’s not complicated, but if you turn it on without warming it up (or pause for an extended time in the off position), all bets are off.

Man that is pretty damn scary

@Polygonhell

FWIW it’s an amp Abyss won’t recommend because at least one owner destroyed their headphones.

lol. Feel bad for the guy.

[orrman]

Hijacking this thread a bit (or maybe not) but if I was looking for a solid state similar in sound signature to the WA33 and to compliment my 1266 TC primary and Susvara secondary while having the Enleum for the opposite priorities - would that be the Niimbus? Xiaudio formula s? Vio550?

Price range is around the 4K USD used market I guess… but I can stretch it to 6K unless I find a WA33 to buy again

[Polygonhell]

Where you’ll struggle to match the WA33, is in the presentation, the reason people love DHT’s is they impart a sort of immediacy that you don’t really get from MOSFETs or JFETs at least on the amps I’ve heard.

If your just looking for a “clean” sound with good bass control there are certainly options, the Nimbus is really in a different class than the Formula S, I know @M0N felt the 550 was close enough to the Nimbus to make it not worth the up charge.

What specifically from the WA33 are you trying to match?

[orrman]

The WA33 provided me with speed and clarity with good sense of space and being somewhat unobtrusive to the headphones. Response across the board was good and balanced.

I think the Enleum adds a bit of mid forwardness and bass emphasis that compliments the Susvara well and for the TC might bring it to a more natural presentation but my desire from the TC is not to be more widely acceptable but to stay a bit in its freakish tuning and be awesome for trance music

With the move from then Spring 3 I might be losing some organicness and smooth presentation but I’m good with that. It was a bit too much for me. Not sure how the WA33 would’ve been with the Rockna (definitely a step towards more forward and neutral) but I think I’m finally ok with that.

[Draaly]

Anyone have the pinout for the mysphere? I know dual entry cables are possible, so now im trying to figure out if it is possible to make a sus cable that works with them

[FiCurious]

Don’t know the pin out, but Peter at DHC made one for me and I had him do a custom split with female 3.5 from the MySphere term to dual 2.5 for the Sus. Works well for me. Not sure it can be made to be compatible with both

[Polygonhell]

I’ve seen it somewhere, possibly the head-if thread.
IIRC it’s L-R-R+L+ from shield to tip, but don’t hold me to that.
Found it

They are both the same, so if you have a dual cable at the headset end, you can plug them in either way around and L and R will be correct

[Christof]

Going to revive this thread with a comparison of the MySphere 3.2 with the Raal SR1b. I think this is an ideal place to put this comparison but if you want me to move it elsewhere let me know.

I’m finally able to compare the Raal SR1b to the MySphere 3.2 after having the MySphere on demo for way too long and dealing with some issues on both. The stock cable broke on the MySphere and had to wait about a week for a replacement then when the Raals came the first pair had no ribbons in them and so Raal shipped out a new pair which came a week later.

I made a playlist of tracks I’ve been listening to recently that I think suit the capabilities of these two headphones:

This comparison reminds me a bit of comparing 1266 and Susvara since the Raal feels more energetic and forward while the MySphere is more capable when it comes to imaging, layering, and detail but is more laid back and has some other drawbacks I’ll get to. I think they are both different enough where you could own both but for my tastes I am preferring the Raal.

I started going through those tracks with the MySphere and what stood out to me was the precise imaging and layering. Especially the distinction between different instruments and vocals at various depths. The stage felt a bit intimate after hearing the Raal the night before. Although it’s ability to layer makes the stage seem large especially in depth. The bass is plenty on most tracks but won’t necessarily get you dancing around to some pop music but it’s not lacking and I don’t listen to any of these songs, especially “Hard Out There”, and find myself wishing for more thump and bass energy. I’ve used the bass frames but find it a bit stuffy so prefer the standard frames the most and it’s what I used for this comparison.

With the Raal, the stage in comparison feels more diffuse but grander. Imaging and layering are not quite as good but still up there compared to other headphones like Susvara and Utopia. The stand out qualities of the Raal for me are timbre, slam, intensity of the attack of notes, and the more weighty low end. Going back to the MySphere after listneing to the Raal and some vocals and instruments sound a bit off. Hard to pin point what it is exactly. I think with vocals it’s that they sound a bit thin or not as dense. For instruments the Mysphere lacks the attack that comes across more clearly on the Raal and the timbre just does not feel as real. The bass on the Raal is slightly more and on the track “About Logan” it felt like the lower string instruments and percussion gained more presence due to the heavier low end presentation.

With both I had the drivers pushed fairly close to my ear with maybe a quarter inch gap between my ear and the driver. I don’t get huge stage when I pull the drivers away, it’s more of a subtle change then I expected, it’s mostly the bass that just fades out.

They both do a great job showing room information like decay and reverb in the space that it’s recorded in or just portraying the reverb that was added. For comfort I think the Raal wins because the padding and headband is softer and the clamp feels less. The MySphere feels a bit more solid but the materials that touch my face are not as soft. They are actually both quite comfy but I prefer the Raal by a bit.

Overall my choice at the moment is the Raal as the timbre and slam is better. I also get a more agressive attack and the comfort is better. The MySphere however excels at imaging, layering, separation, and detail. Basically it has better technicalites. Sort of like how I’ve become less interested in the 1266 over time, I could see myself becoming more interested in the MySphere after spending time with the Raal since the MySphere is more capable but I think the better timbre on the Raal might keep me using the Raal. I also have the convolution filters to test on the Raal, perhaps that will help with the slight issues I have with imaging and separation on it.