Due to popular request, this has it’s own thread now, to both make it more convenient and keep the dac thread more specifically focused about dacs I guess lol (although I don’t plan on doing more comparisons in that regard soooo).
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A power supply Shit list? Hmmmm.
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I could but I don’t really think I’ve tried enough (more importantly paid enough attention to) to really justify doing that. I tried to include some psu suggestions when talking about digital chains I guess lol. Something I could look into but not really sure if I could do that justice
Also avoiding speakers, since I don’t have as much experience there, but really the biggest reason I don’t want to is because I don’t want to have to talk about preamps lol
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I do have a quick question about the shit list. I noticed a while ago that the Susvara Amp/DAC pairings disappeared and weren’t included in the shortlisted shitlist either. Is there a reason for this? Or is this something you’re planning on adding in the future? Thank you so much for all the work you’ve done on the shit list, it has been a wonderful guide for many of us when considering what our next steps should be with our systems (according to our preferences ofc).
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I decided to remove the susvara from the shortlist because the shortlist is something that focuses on high value pairings with higher value headphones. Truthfully I don’t really know if any of the pairings for the susvara fall under that category for me due to how needy it is, in comparison to putting together a chain for some of the other headphones on the shortlist it’s really quite expensive in comparison
I still really like it, but I just don’t think on most chains that I’d consider it a value pick. You are rewarded with one of the best headphones when you put together a good chain for it, it’s just that at that point you likely aren’t considering value all that much. It only basically has good dollar per sound in the very upper end of it’s chains, otherwise there’s not really many “reasonable” chains for it that get you most the way there like there are for the headphones on the shitlist. If you’re looking in the 16-20k ish range for a whole headphone setup (used), I do think there can be some value in that range for the susvara compared to other headphones. Below that though, I think many other headphones make a more compelling case for sound per dollar imo because they can take advantage of pairings that squeeze more out of them then something you can put together for a susvara in the same range.
Perhaps I’ll include it only as a higher end option, but not sure. The hekse is included on the shitlist because I think it’s a headphone that can offer more value than the susvara can in more chains
Additional note: the section about doing pairings for every headphone listed was dropped for the sake of my sanity, so the shortlist remains to both take it’s place and serve another purpose. If you want, I can do a list of pairings with the susvara throughout the various price brackets, but it might be awhile before I do that due to lack of time and motivation
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Uuufff, Mon the work you have put in there. Respect and thank you very much.
A few more Zmf headphones would be cool to maintain, IMR Acustics as Iem is also interesting is not all good but have some good Iem’s unfortunately much also limited.
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Wow, thank you for the thorough response. Makes sense why you took it off/didn’t include it in the shortlist either. I know there are quite a few people on this forum with Susvaras, so I’m sure a pairing list would be greatly appreciated by more than just me (even if that list goes into the 16-20k+ range lol). Maybe it can be in a new section, idk how you wanna organize it. Take your time though, and thank you for the time you’ve already put into the shit list.
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I was looking forward to this a bit but i could see your sanity dropping off as that list grew. No TV and No beer make M0N,… something something…
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I don’t think he can afford TV or beer. He’s got to cut corners somewhere.
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It’s true, I don’t watch tv (or movies, or really most anything visual anymore), and also don’t drink. Just no interest in the visual stuff and alcohol really adds up over time lol (not that I really like it all that much anyways)
I was actually pissed having to put a TV in the living room for a friend because it ruined my speaker setup, glad it’s not there anymore. Not having a big reflection surface between speakers is a massive plus
I can still potentially do it eventually, but it’s just kinda draining to go though everything especially things where my memory isn’t as strong and I could miss good pairings that I just didn’t think about. I haven’t even finished the descriptions side of things yet, so I should probably get that done before I start on more pairing stuff.
There’s a whole lot of time that goes into pairings, and that’s genuinely the thing that sucks up the most time and energy for me as there’s so much to consider (that you basically have to consider and can’t ignore or haphazardly do), so really most of the time that’s what most of my effort goes to (even if it might not look like it lol)
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@M0N where would you put the Mola Mola Tambaqui in your lists? how come it’s not in any?
Nahhhh, was just trying to get in the sweet simpsons reference. I wonder if there is a way to do it in more generalities without it being misleading. “Pair X headphone with a more Y leaning chain.” But i think that may gloss over the magic individual pieces may bring.
It used to be, but I ended up removing it because I couldn’t make up my mind if I really liked it or not. It sounded good when I would listen to it, but I never came away wanting more or being satisfied with it. It’s something I’m so iffy on at this point I took it off the list because I don’t know if it really belonged on it (since really all the list is are things that I like + some things that offer a unique experience even if it isn’t to my taste, which I don’t think the mola mola really fits either category)
Based solely how I feel about how much enjoyment I got from it I’d probably put it below the SW1X, but it used to be placed above the weiss but I think now if I had to put it back on there it would be below the weiss. The weiss was honestly one reason it got taken off, I think it fills the role of combined streamer + dac better, offers better value, and I like it more sonically (even if it might not be as immediately technical as the mola mola). I think one of the problems I have with the mola mola is that it feels surface level, but this isn’t fair to call it that.
It’s a weird thing to say considering that it pulls a great amount of resolution/detail, has great liquidity, and has a nice sense of slight bloom and slight sweetness that makes it enjoyable and never harsh perhaps even slightly soft, but I guess to me it just feels vivid yet flat. Not like spatially and dynamically flat (although it’s not as impressive as other dacs in its range in that regard), but a combination of both too much and no contrast, very black and white and not much in-between (because it seems to take information that would be in-between and shove it to black or white giving it it’s vividness), and I think that’s the aspect that got to me in the end. Actually you know what no, it’s that it just didn’t sound like it had any energy, immediacy or directness, it’s more just going through the paces and doesn’t actually feel lively about doing it and that’s probably what gave me that lack of satisfaction in the end. It sounds vivid and technical yet flat and not really direct or energetic and because of that it just sounds off leaving me feeling mixed after each time I listened. It sounded organic and convincing in specific aspects in isolation, but it’s like there’s a barrier preventing that feeling from really happening, and the overall sound feels more vivid and contrasty than it should be (leading to the feeling of a deficiency in natural contrast or things properly in the middle)
It’s like watching one of those demo modes on an amazing TV where there’s a lot to like there but things are definitely blown out to impress the average Joe and it’s trying to show as much contrast and naturalness as possible yet is clearly going overboard and just ends up looking off and feeling unnatural. Basically giving you the impression that while some aspects of it are reasonably real in isolation, it’s still very apparent things aren’t in the full picture and it’s just a TV, compared to other dacs in it’s price range which can give you an experience closer to actually seeing something in person (not all that close, but closer than the mola mola). Kinda reminds me of some of the weird coloration that dcs has and potentially chord, but I’d take the mola mola over a dave (with no mscaler) for my personal preferences, although I’d probably rather have a dcs bartok instead. And I’m not the biggest of those dacs either, so there will be other dacs I’d rather have instead as well of course. I don’t like doing comparisons to vision because it’s a lot harder to trick your eyes then your ears (and my vision is also shit anyways) but I don’t know a good way how to explain what I was hearing.
I don’t really know, I don’t know if I like it or not. I respect it, I kinda enjoyed it when I had it, and it’s something that I can see some really liking, but I don’t think it’s for me, and I can’t decide if I liked it myself. Really regardless of if I liked it or not or where I think it compares I don’t want to list it because it should be very clear from the above that I can’t make up my mind on it lol, so I don’t feel confident putting it on there regardless. It is good, but I’d really want to hear it one more time before/if I ever put it on the list again
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It’s so hard to describe the intangibles sometimes. I get what you’re trying to say and I think you did it justice but I lol’d reading through you struggling to say it.
…as far as I’m concerned, visual, tastes and even tactile descriptions are all (or should be) interchangeable when describing audio. Why make it harder on ourselves?
I’ll do it in full form eventually, if I am going to do it I’m going to try and not half ass it. I just need to wait until I 1. have time, 2. have inspiration, and 3. have the urge to write (probably the hardest one to get), and I’ll probably do it all within the span of a few days. That’s how dac comparison pt1 was written, 80% of that was written and typed within a night (and it shows in some places lol), so I just have to wait for one of those to hit again.
I just don’t tend to use them because I don’t think they end up checking out/working well in practice, and can be pretty misleading as what works for hearing doesn’t work for visions and vice versa when it comes to perception in some cases, and in others definitions and meanings change too much, makes things too confusing at times, and I’d rather accidentally convey nothing than the opposite of what I intend
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Sounds like the perfect canjam showpiece to trick me then lol 
What would you say is a tambaqui-done-right? meaning what it’s strong at and similar ideas sonically but higher level of execution and less downsides
I really really liked it with the Woo Audio WA23
I wouldn’t say trick because it is a good dac, but it is something that rides on a bit more wow factor than I prefer lol.
I’d have to think but probably the high end dcs apex stuff right away for something that has similar characteristics without some of the downsides at a higher level (but I don’t think they’re that similar imo) in terms of others hmmm I’ll have to think because the tambaqui is a more unique sound so I can’t think of my direct upgrades/equivalents of the top of my head.
I thought it was a great pairing with the wa33 as well, really liked it there
Perhaps a bit harsh on second thought, it’s not clearly going overboard, it’s more subtly going overboard. If it was clearly going overboard I probably wouldn’t have liked it at all. I feel like most people I’ve seen get the dacs they end up offloading them quicker than normal so I wonder if it’s for that reason or not
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This is a very fair statement and something I hadn’t considered.
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@mon [quote=“db_Cooper, post:19, topic:1804”]
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What a GREAT line!!! One to remember.
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