So I did a recent comparison on my preamp to found out how much my preamp is actually buffing my system. Then realize my Supratek preamp is actually pretty badass lol.
^ So I said this… Well I take it back. If you do not feed the Platimon some good equipment, it will probably not sound as good as you would want it to. Probably like all good equipment, you want to feed it with something pretty freaking good lol. I wanted to test if the Platimon still sounded good with entry level power amp (Schiit Vidar 2) and preamp (NITSCH MAGNI PIETY) and well… I didn’t really like how it sounded lol. It still sounded pretty good, but at the same time, not as enjoyable compared to when the 45 tube preamp was hooked. Enjoyment level plummeted a lot. Hooked up my Supratek preamp back into the chain and everything sounded so dang amazing again.
What the Plaitmon still retain with the NITSCH Magni Piety as the preamp to me:
Drums still sounded amazing
Soundstage width is still amazing
Dedicated Left and Right channel was still pretty cool
What the Platimon loss with the NITSCH Magni Piety as the preamp to me:
Mids sounded lifeless to me
Electric Guitar don’t sound as good to me compare to my original setup
Imaging blurs a little more and that in return kinda hurt all the little details I could usually hear
Music sounded more clutter and instrumental separation was an issue
Soundstage seems a little more flat since it seem to have less depth
Clarity seems to take a hit on the Platimon
What the Platimon Gain with the Supratek 45 Cabernet DHT Preamp
Mids came to life for me, especially noticeable for female vocals and electric guitar as that is my main requirement in music
Imaging is more pinpoint picture perfect again for me
Feels like I can hear much more detail, probably because instrumental separation is better. Its probably thanks to the pinpoint imaging as well.
Soundstage had more depth and it feels more like a concert again
Clarity is much better
Music sounded “bigger”
I feel like I am repeating myself from the other thread, but I did only test it out on the Platimon speaker. So, I will say this again. If you get a Platimon speaker, you will probably want some good gear so it can sound really good. With my current gear using the Supratek Cabernet 45 tube Preamp, its the best I heard for electric guitar and drums, imaging is super amazing, and details are much easier to hear. Without my Supratek preamp, I will probably only like the Platimon as the best drums sounding speaker for me. Female vocals though? My god, Supratek 45 tube really help female vocals on the Platimon. I don’t know why there is such a big drastic change in that, but I probably don’t want to remove my 45 tube from my system as I think that might be the key why female vocals always sound amazing in my system. I can see why all reviewers recommend a tube amp for the Platimon. The Platimon speaker nature is a clean midrange. But because something is clean, doesn’t necessarily make it enjoyable to probably a lot of people. You probably want that warmth and texture you get from tubes in the midrange. I wouldn’t call the vocals thin without the tubes, but it feels very incomplete. With 45 tubes, its a good direction if you like vocals. The Supratek preamp just makes vocals easier and much enjoyable to listen to.
So I am still on the search of the poweramp for the Platimon and am trying to do a lot of research on it. Pretty much all reviewers recommends a tube amp for the Platimon. I know everyone likes tube, but I watched the reviewer’s other speaker review videos and found they sometimes recommend solid-state poweramp. Honestly it might be if your speaker could run tube, might as well. I know tube vs solid state don’t really matter once getting into the higher end of things and its really how the hardware is design. But tube amps are usually just a safe route of knowing what you are getting into, like if you want really want more midrange and a holographic soundstage, a lot of tube amps will provide that. If you want more “oomph” in the bass, a lot of solid state will provide that.
I think with all that said, my new poweramp/speaker amp candidates are (Supratek is staying no matter what, so I will probably use an integrated amp as a power amp):
Decware ZMA Amp (highest contender so far) / Maybe the Torii V since some people say its better than the ZMA for some reason, but the ZMA power supply still interests me more / Maybe the Sarah 300B amp if it can drive the Platimon speaker (The website says it can drive as low as 89 db speaker, but maybe it won’t be enough power for my genre). I will probably talk to Steve one day for his recommendation if I pull that trigger to be on the waiting list for a year.
A 20wpc Push pull integrated amp from Korea (not Allnic) that uses 6L6 tube. It is said it was specifically made to drive an vintage RCA speaker so the amp itself carry some of that vintage sound I guess.
The AGD monoblock class D amp still looks cool, but its the most expensive and I heard it still carry that “Class D” sound. So I gotta really hear it first before I purchase this if I still want to go on this “cleaner” route.
I am not addicted to the Platimon btw. I did not do this experiment as an excuse to listen to the Platimon on a weekday for the 3rd week in a row. I am just writing this down to help me remember that this is the direction I should go. Hopefully, I am going in a right direction… hopefully.
I think the price for the Platimon VC One just increase to $8K LOL. I guess the company probably realize that selling the speaker with the stand was a little too good of a package. If you buy the Platimon VC One without speaker stands it’s around $6K. With speaker stands and the isolation ball feet is $8K.
I really was blessed with luck in beginning of the year. I basically bought a brand new speaker with the stands and even a special exclusive ball feet that I am probably the only one in US to have for almost 50% of the current MSRP all because of an “impulse buy” in the used market. I hope I didn’t used up all my luck for the year in the beginning of the year lol. If I did, I say it’s worth it since this is the best audio equipment I still have heard in my life and i am still being wowed for almost 1 month later.
This post will only focus on No Toe-In vs With Toe-In For The Platimon VC One Speaker
The Setup
Before we get started I guess I should list my speaker setup just in cased if anything change from the last post.
The server/streamer is the data source of my system, the DAC is the brain of my system, the preamp is the heart of my system, the power amp is the muscle of my system, and the speakers are my choice of equipment to listen to music.
My setup is:
ROON Rock - Intel NUC 7i7 > EMM Labs NS1 > [Silver Sonic D-110 AES] Mojo Audio Mystique EVO B4B 21 > [Audience Ohno XLR] Custom 45/6SN7 Tube Only Supratek Cabernet DHT > [Gabriel Gold Extreme MK II with KLE RCA connectors] Schiit Vidar 2 > [Micca Pure Copper Speaker Cable] Mon Acoustics Platimon VC One
I would say my system will sound much more natural and have a really good timbre in the midrange thanks to the Supratek Cabernet DHT preamp. So keep that in mind when I start talking how the Platimon timbre sounds magnificent, it’s because of the Supratek Cabernet DHT preamp and the Platimon is a revealing system kind of equipment where if you feed it good equipment, the Platimon will really show you how good your equipment really is.
All generic power cords.
The left speaker is 4 feet away from the side wall and 2.5 feet away from the front wall. The right speaker is 2.5 feet away from the side wall and 2.5 feet away from the front. I should have just made the left speaker 2.5 feet away from the side wall, but I didn’t think about it. The carpet on stage left probably increases the left speaker height by a couple of centimeters. The placement was more of a convenience placement at that time. The speakers from left to right are about 5.5 feet away from each other. The listening position is 3.5 feet away from the speakers in the center. The back wall is about 5 feet away from the listening position. There is a TV in the middle of the setup and room treatment is bare minimum. Sorry, it’s just going to be like this for a while.
I do get really excited on some songs, but I try to contain myself and try to remain seated most of the time.
The soundstage is very wide and has much more depth. The wideness of the soundstage reminds me of the PNC Music Pavilion in North Carolina which is like a 20,000-person concert venue. Might be an exaggeration on my part, but it really gave me that feeling on a lot of modern songs. Artist and instruments seems more further away, but the music don’t seem to get quieter though. It’s hard to describe it besides calling it more “median concert-like” to me.
Very holographic as well. Of course, depending on the track, but I always love to use one of my favorite songs Voodoo Child (Slight Return) by Jimi Hendrix. If I can hear the guitar play all around me including behind me, it pass the holographic soundstage test. Toe-in is holographic as well, but no Toe-in, music is just wrapped more around you and because of its more expanded wide soundstage, it’s more magical in terms in soundstage in my opinion.
Overall separation and layering seem much better which is pretty hard to believe for me.
Vocals are less forward and blend more in the music, which feels more correct for me and fixes some imaging issues Toe-in has and makes the music presented more organic overall.
Not as resolving as Toe-in, midrange resolution decreases by a level, I think the difference in clarity is pretty big to me. And I honestly don’t really think there is a next level of clarity after Platimon Toe-In, but the summit goes deeper than where I am currently, so anything is possible.
Imaging blurs a smidge so it’s no longer picture-perfect on imaging.
Timbre feels affected. Like with no Toe-in made the instruments less interesting to me for some reason. With Toe-in, it sounds more real than real life, which I know is a really stupid phrasing, but it sounds that resolving. Even inorganic instruments like the electric guitar sound more exciting and epic when the Platimon is Toe-in. Even female vocals are just something to really die for. Hearing Ado screaming in Aishite Aishite Aishite around 3:30 - 3:42 sends a chill to my soul that I couldn’t get that same feeling in no Toe-in.
Fewer details in No Toe-in. Because the imaging is slightly worse, I pick up on fewer nuances vs if the Platimon is Toe-in.
2nd Take On The Con From My Earlier 1st Impression Post
The above quote was my 1st impression of the Platimon and I was using only Toe-In position at that time due to my lack of space. My overall position was horrible at that time, but I later (which is now) found out this “Con” on vocal placement to be more organic can be fixed with no Toe-in.
So I did a 2nd take on Stellar Stellar - From THE FIRST TAKE by Hoshimachi Suisei and no Toe-in fix her vocal imaging issue. So Toe-in makes the vocals much more forward where her vocals were in front of the speakers. The issue was when the singer uses different voice techniques, it will place them in a different position of the soundstage. Example, head vocals is more forward and chest vocals, the singer will take a step back from the head vocals position. When the Platimon is setup as No Toe-in, it places the singer deeper in the soundstage and the singer blends in with the music much moreso than Toe-in where the singer seems to have more of a spotlight when they are using head vocals. So when Suisei uses her chest vocals, it no longer seems like she is taking a step back when the Platimon is not Toe-in. She still may be moving based on her vocal technique, but because imaging is slightly more blurry and the soundstage places all the vocals deeper into the music, it’s really hard to tell if her vocals are being placed in a different spot. So if you are a fan of female vocals with acoustic music, I can easily recommend the Platimon now, just make sure you set it up with no Toe-in.
Side Note On Bass
The reviewers were right. You do not need a subwoofer with the Platimon in a small room like mine unless you want to unlock the last octave of the bass note. The bass pressure that fills the air with the Platimon is incredible. But in order to unlock this incredible bass pressure in the air, you need to play about 80db which is unsafe to listen for a long session. Bass could still sound more resolving, but that honestly could be fixed by room treatment for me. Plus adding a sub isn’t really gonna hurt the Platimon. The addition of the sub will most likely help the overall system sound better and I don’t have to play in a bleeding volume to fill the air with bass pressure.
Conclusion
Why Choose No-Toe In?
If you want a much wider and more depth in your soundstage.
A more fun holographic soundstage depending on the track, mostly psychological music and probably modern pop songs.
It has a much better instrumental separation and layering.
For a more organic presentation in music for vocals
Why Choose Toe-In?
If you want a more resolving, clearer sound.
If you want to hear more details in your music.
If you want to have picture-perfect imaging.
If you want more excitement and more realism in your instruments/vocals sound (not imaging).
I really would like to have the best of both worlds and it’s probably obtainable either through certain synergy through gears or proper room treatment and speaker placement. At where I am at in my speaker adventure today, I probably got to choose 1. If you are in the same position as me for some reason, here is my advice to you. If you want something more organic and a much more fun holographic soundstage, set your Platimon to no Toe-in. If you want something more exciting on the instruments and vocals and something more resolving, set your Platimon with Toe-in and probably put some DHT tubes in your system for an addicting midrange.
Me personally, I could not sacrifice the resolving technicalities of the Platimon VC One when its Toe-In. It’s just an awe of a performance speaker in that position. No matter how deep and wide the soundstage is with no Toe-In, I rather sacrifice soundstage and even an organic presentation on vocals, for a more resolving technical version of the Platimon VC One. So I will most likely be choosing Toe-In for my future Platimon VC One setup unless I find equipment to either make the Platimon more resolving sounding in its no Toe-In state or find a tube amp to make it more holographic and more music filling in the room while keeping the Platimon in a Toe-In state. Or maybe even a new speaker placement… Now lets transition to the epilogue to the Next Step of my Platimon VC One journey!
Next Step
This was only focusing on No Toe-In vs Yes Toe-In which I should have done after finishing where I would really like the speaker placement to be at. The current speaker placement is just so convenient because I can watch movies on it. I also don’t have to move the about 30lb speaker + about 15lb speaker stands to open the door. It’s not heavy, but it’s annoying. I would like to still hear the Platimons if they are properly placed in my room currently. I taped down the estimated location already which is based on NRD LOTS YouTube video. Unfortunately, this weekend is over, so that is something to look forward to next weekend. If I could get the best of both world on the next speaker placement, that would be amazing. I should also try half way toe-in maybe next time and looking at the pictures, the Platimon speakers is more facing out the room rather than no toe-in. Either way, there is a lot more to experiment next weekend.
Speaker placement will change the speakers and different speakers will see different levels of impact but in general. Toe in will give you more image focus and detail. No toe will as you correctly identified give you more dimensional space.
It’s hard to tell what your room size in from the pictures but the first thing that stick out at me is that they’re too close together and secondly you don’t want stuff between the plane of your speakers. Push the gear back and give the speakers six inches on either side while keeping the toe. Moving the speakers apart will have a similar effect as reducing their toe in. Moving them forward or backwards will help with the weight and change the stage depth presentation.
Also the level of toe in important as point the toe straight at your ears will sometimes be too much. Depending on how far back you’re sitting, you’ll get surprising results by pointing the speakers just outside of your shoulders.
Trial and error is your friend and take a lot of notes.
So I forgot to post it here, but my current room is 12.5 ft of depth and 12 feet of width, so it’s pretty much a square room. This is my hobby room so, I basically swap everything from 1 side to the other, so that is why some of my posters is still there which will be remove once I actually settle on a speaker placement and finally decide to install acoustic panels.
My first experiment was actually 4x4x4x4, where everything is pretty much feet apart from each other. I enjoyed it, but only got 1 hour on it. I remember everything really open up when I first listen to it, but didn’t pay attention to detail and how the instruments sounded since it was too late in the night during that time. The speakers were in front of the audio gear chain and everything was symmetri it to the current setup because I wanted to watch something on the TV. I thought this new setup was pretty neat and didn’t like how the preamp tubes are behind my right channel speaker. I am not too sure if the tube amp being behind the speaker is a problem, but it’s going to be hard to move the preamp since my interconnect is really limiting in terms of size.
I will experiment more on speaker placement, but more on the weekend.
Side note: I think I want to experiment more with no toe in when I move my speakers again because I really enjoy that deep and wide soundstage. I never thought I could get a soundstage like that in my setup let alone in a small room.
When you’re ready to explore further, speaker cables can have a dramatic impact here. But taking the time to get good baselines and understand what things sound like before switching things around is the best way to hear the contrast.
In a few weeks after you have played with your speakers some more, pull everything out of the room except for what you need to make music and a single simple chair. Take good notes BEFORE you do this and then spend a week listening as you adjust your speakers and your chair in the empty room.
Take the opportunity to vacuum the rug really well and dust around all the molding on the floor near the carpet, that way when you bring your tv etc. back in the carpet will be fresh and dust free for a while.
This post is about finding my speaker placement in my current room.
Intro
Learned a lot from watching some videos and reading articles here and there during the week. I learned that I have the worst audiophile room imaginable for speakers which is a square room. Having a square room is the worst thing you could do for a speaker and you basically want a golden ratio. The reason at least from what I have and think in my head is that the sweet spot for many audiophiles is basically 1/3 away from the back wall which is a dead space for square room. A dead space at least from what got from other people is that my bass is basically non-existent which made a lot of sense in my past setup. I had to do something of a unique setup with the subwoofer to breathe bass in the old Polk R200 setup. This new setup is more flexible, but I cannot get that sweet spot in the middle of the room, I just got to be a little more creative. People in forums said having a .5 difference and not an exact perfect square helps a lot, but I am pretty skeptical if the .5 really helps. Maybe it did actually help because I was able to find my “sweet” spot pretty easily. I also learned that the square room is still manageable, I just got to know my consequences and work with it, which is an extremely limited listening position. My options were 2-3 feet from the front walls or back walls. Even with room treatment, because of the square room, people have said that I really can’t get rid of the dead space in the middle even with room treatment. If someone goes to the room treatment route for the square room, I basically have to put enough furniture in the square room to transform it into a rectangle which will be pretty hard for my already small limited space of a room. If I were to try to transform my room into a rectangle and follow the golden ratio, I think it wouldn’t be worth it. Might as well build a listening shed at that point. So for this speaker placement, I went with the option of 2-3 feet from the front walls or back walls. I chose the back wall which I will explain later.
My Current Speaker Placement That I Would Like To Call My Sweet Spot For My Room
I really enjoy the symmetrical idea of having your speaker symmetrical from the side wall and the front wall, so I went with that. My current room is 12.5 ft of depth and 12 feet of width which I know is a nightmare.
I am 2 feet away from the back wall
7.4 feet from the listening position to the speakers
About 7 feet minus 1-centimeter speakers left to right measure end to end. Measuring the left speaker AMT tweeter to the right speaker AMT tweeter is about 6.5 feet.
Both speakers are about 2.5 feet away from the side wall and front wall
A little toe-in to my shoulders
My setup is:
ROON Rock - Intel NUC 7i7 > EMM Labs NS1 > [Silver Sonic D-110 AES] Mojo Audio Mystique EVO B4B 21 > [Audience Ohno XLR] Custom 45/6SN7 Tube Only Supratek Cabernet DHT > [Gabriel Gold Extreme MK II with KLE RCA connectors] Schiit Vidar 2 > [Micca Pure Copper Speaker Cable] Mon Acoustics Platimon VC One
As I mentioned in the intro, my options are very limited. Because of my almost square room, I cannot be 4-6 feet away from the back wall since that is a dead space. I did some bass hunting in my room and walked around where I could hear the bass. I basically just put on Yeat new album “2093” which people call it “Rage” music. With the new Yeat album in the background, I was able to find a couple of positions I really like the sound of the bass. When I am close to the side wall or back wall, the bass gets amazingly heavy which I really like. So that was my reason for getting near the back wall since the bass does get heavy and I am still in the middle position of my speaker. But now, I face a new issue. Midrange and treble clarity got worse. So I cannot be all the way back on the wall. I remember 1 of Nickmimi video recommendations had Ron from NRD put a mattress on the back of the wall. I didn’t have a mattress, but I put multiple big pillows that pushed my seating position 2 feet away from the back wall. So from me to the back wall is a wall of pillow that is about 2 feet. The reason why I am about 7.4 feet away from the speakers is because the max range I can get bass is 3 feet away from the back wall and 2 feet was the sweet spot to my ears on amazing clarity, amazing bass, and amazing soundstage. The bass was super crazy when I was all the way in the back, like a mind-breakingly woah kind of bass. Being 2 feet away lessens it, but I got better response on the midrange and treble that the bass is not drowning the music anymore. The pillows might have helped too maybe.
My current room is a little unique from the average square room. I do not have 4 corners, only 2. It’s still a square. The reason I only have 2 is because one corner is filled up with a mountain of a wooden piece that takes up 4 feet in depth of the room. The wooden piece basically reaches the ceiling and stays in the corner cause it’s the only place I can put it without moving it to another room. The other corner across from it is a glass shrine of “goods”. Next to the shrine of “goods” is the plastic storage bin of my sneaker collection. Both pretty much reach the ceiling as well. Next to the sneaker collection is my computer setup. So the entire half of the room is dedicated to the speakers which is unfortunately the only place I can put them. The reason I like 2.5 feet from the side wall and front wall is because it was the best place I could put it in the room where the soundstage sounds the best in the room where I can get a good amount of depth and width while the speakers are holographic and disappearing when I am near 2 feet away from the back wall.
Now, why do I go with a little toe-in even though I thoroughly enjoyed maximum toe-in in the last post I made? I followed DB Cooper advice on toe-in a little to my shoulders. I like that advice a lot because I can sit up straight for a more wide soundstage and lean back for more of a clearer picture of the music. I am not going to lie, but I pretty much lean the entire time. I actually realize why Mon Acoustic purposely made the speaker stands so short compared to the average speaker stands with this new setup. When you lean back, my ear is level with the tweeter, and the Platimon was made with jazz/classical music in mind. I don’t really listen to jazz, but for classical music, I do like to lean back in my chair at home (can’t lean back in public cause the chairs won’t let me). That and I am also a manlet so the short speaker stands all worked out.
Results Of This New Speaker Placement Setup In My Room?
I feel like I did get the best of both worlds on tonality, imaging, and soundstage from last week’s setup that I was craving. Because I got the best of both worlds, it just got much easier to “hear” everything in the music and my speaker experience just got more “magical”. When the speakers were placed out toward the room, I got a really wide soundstage, and layering and separation were better, but in return my imaging was more blurry and certain instruments didn’t sound as amazing anymore. All the way toe-in made the music crystal clear, but the soundstage got much more narrower and smaller which honestly loses the whole point of speakers and is what makes speakers so amazing. Once you hear the deep and wide soundstage and music filling up the soundstage, it’s hard to go back. So with this new setup, I feel like I got a good balance of both wide and deep soundstage while the imaging and music have amazing clarity. Music also sounds much more holographic and filling. I think I finally and truly understand the meaning of speakers disappearing from the soundstage.
1 example is in a Vocaloid song like Giga-P - CH4NGE (TeddyLoid Remix) and the music really just pops towards you and around you. The music just really fills up the soundstage and not in a congested way. I still got amazing instrumental separation and layering. Even though the soundstage and so deep and wide, the music doesn’t sound quiet. It feels like it’s being played all around the soundstage and not a mono way either. You get different sounds covering stage left compared to stage right and yet it doesn’t feel like there is any empty space at all. I also get both an intimate and concert-like presentation. For example at 1:38-1:40, it sounds like KAFU (Vocaloid) is talking right next to your left ear and then KAFU goes back deep in the soundstage back to the center. WHAAAAT? THAT IS SPOOKY AND REALLY AWESOME AT THE SAME TIME!!! You can get that presentation with headphones, but it’s just much more impressive with the Platimon speakers just because of how massive the soundstage feels and the Platimon imaging is top notch so I got a really good imagery of her vocals moving in the soundstage. Not to mention the eeriness of the backup vocals, the bass raising the hype of the music, the beat drop, KAFU herself sounding amazing, and the echo of her artificial voice making the soundstage feel so huge… Man, I really love listening to this song with the Platimon. Now I know why people love to use the word magic because my brains feel so “WTH, how is this possible”. Like, I am in a small room and the presentation feels so huge and sounds just feels like they are going out of bounds of what I would expect from a speaker. This is some psychedelic trip just from listening to music, it’s the new shrooms. Speaking of psychedelic trips, I highly recommend listening to Jimi Hendrix - Voodoo Child (Slight Return) with the Platimon if you get a chance. That got to be one of the most amazing experiences I had with audio equipment at home. I still don’t really understand how it can be played so well behind me when I myself don’t really have much room behind me. Next-level psychedelic experience right here.
Placing near the back wall level up my bass experience with my speaker. I really don’t think you need a subwoofer. I used to think you needed to turn up the Platimon to 80db for pressure in the room, but not anymore. When I am near the back wall, that bass pressure is heavy. Modern hip hop music like Yeat new album or even Kid Cudi new album was like “wow”. I never heard bass like that in a non-concert setting even with my old Polk R200 setup from last year with a cheap subwoofer. A clean, yet soundstage-filling powerful bass.
Thankfully being 2 feet away from the back wall with only big pillows between me and the back wall, I still get amazing results in midrange and treble. Everything still sounds amazingly detailed and I can really hear the reverb and echo so clearly. The vocals and electric guitar still sound amazing. Ado screaming in the song Aishite Aishite Aishite around 2:55 - 3:43 (which is my favorite part of the whole song) still gives me goosebumps.
So yep, this is my “sweet spot” in this room for my Platimon speakers. Other people reviews did mention that the Platimon are easy speakers to work with within a small room where you can get away with 1 or 2 feet away from the front wall. So maybe the lead designer had small-room listeners like myself in mind when he designed this Platimon speaker. So that is probably why I could make it work and sound good to me in my small room.
So I went back and setup the Tiny Radials and Polk R200 speakers to compare but…
The Platimon is just leagues better than both the speakers in every way and it should be considering the price is over 10x the cost with the stands and speaker feet. Honestly, its been really hard listening to anything else lately when the Platimon is an option. In my head its like, “why use anything else when the Platimon is available for use, and its the best experience pretty much always no matter the genre”. I actually found myself skipping songs or not finishing a song on the Tiny Radials and the Polk R200 because all I wanted to do is to hurry up and listen to the Platimon. I think I did multiple genres and 1 song each genre, so about 1 hour each of the Tiny Radials and Polk R200, and spent the rest of the 5 hours listening to the Platimon. I also don’t think I could do any other speakers honestly. I wanted to try the Polk R200 again to see if I prefer a warmer speaker and I just miss the details, high-level clarity, the wow factor on the high end, and even cymbals that the Platimon provide. Cymbals on the Polk R200 don’t really have much of an impact compared to the Platimon and overall made the drummer experience pretty lackluster. I never really felt like that before on any other audio product. Like I would still find value in other audio products when I owned the Susvara and strangely still hold the Onkyo A800 up high in my opinion because it can offer bass like no other headphones that I tried. The Platimons just really do it all for me and do it best. I thought all speaker’s soundstages would be really amazing like the Platimon if you get the listening position right. The soundstage was still pretty good when I went from the Tiny Radials to the Polk R200. Then I got to the Platimon and I was like “Holy crap”… The levels of improvement from the Polk R200 to the Platimon is an insane jump. The Platimon plays more out of bounds, is much much wider, and much much deeper. Plus the Platimon got a unique left and right soundstage that I didn’t really get with any other audio equipment. I think the dedicated left and right channel is really pulling some magic on some unique placement on instruments. I am really glad on the jump in performance on the 2 speakers vs the Platimon because it really showed me the difference between good audio equipment and hi-end. It really makes me think the ridiculously expensive cost is justifiable because this is an unimaginable experience and addicting at that. I would never have imagined audio sounding this addicting before. In a real concert setting, it’s with other people, so I am most likely under the influence and riding with the crowd hype vs actually listening to the music. No one here to influence me, I can let my mind just wander off in this magical musical experience. Classical orchestra setting, a different answer. I just got to deal with people’s coughs and nothing really going to replicate a classical orchestra in a good music hall.
Conclusion
So that was my speaker placement experience, now what? Well, I feel very satisfied with what I got right now. I did consider just making this the last post and pretty much quit this hobby and just spend the rest of my days enjoying what I have right now. It’s really hard to imagine that this could get better, but I have seen a video of someone 1 million dollar setup and I know there is no limit to how much better this hobby could get. I may make maybe 1 more post talking about the different isolation ball feet I got for the Platimon speaker which was mentioned very early in this thread. Honestly, my current motivation is to listen to my entire library again on the Platimon which is going to take multiple months. I know I still have room for improvement, especially on room treatment. Not motivated knowing I am dealing with an almost square room. I rather pour that funding into a dedicated listening shed or even a new house with an amazing ceiling and a room with a golden ratio than fixing an almost square room. I also learned that if it sounds the most amazing to me right now, who cares anymore. I have finally achieved what I wanted from a “hifi” setup. I got a good headphone setup for a quiet listening session and a speaker setup for the full musical experience. So now I can finally focus on deep diving into other music genres again and going to live classical orchestras. I would probably at least buy a really big shelf like the Salamander Designs Synergy System to at least put my gears against the wall and clean up anything between the speakers. That’s for sure what I am going to do. I might replace the TV with a projector to get rid of the TV, but that’s a maybe. I got to see how this new rack looks in the room first.
I guess something to last note is I hope more people can truly experience the Platimon speakers. I truly think the Platimon are something really special. I would say listen to it at an audio show, but now knowing how much the room really impacts every speaker, the most you can get is an idea of what it could sound like from an audio show. Unless the listening room is amazing for some reason like maybe a demo shop or something. I would say the base nature of the Platimon speaker in my opinion is that it is a modern-sounding speaker with really nice bass and unique left and right imaging placement. When I say modern-sounding, I mean more focus on super high clarity, fast-sounding with a lot going on up top, and a lot of little details can be heard in the music. So if lush, sweet, or rich-sounding is something you are looking for, this is not it. I say DHT tubes like my 45 tubes help balance the modern nature of the speaker and the sweet, rich-sounding midrange you would get. I would highly recommend trying the Platimon with DHT tubes in the system if possible because I think this combination is really magical.
If I come back next week on the difference in isolation feet, there is that. If not, then I hope you can find your match-made-in-heaven audio equipment and thanks to everyone that helped me along the way on this short journey, especially DBCooper and NickMimi. If I find something new within the year to replace the Platimon, that would be lame of me, but at the same time awesome because my mind would probably explode from excitement since the Platimon is my highest peak of audio gear. If I come back because of headphones, that would be equally as awesome too because I would need something really exciting to get my blood pumping compared to the Platimon. I would probably lurk around for used cables and furniture.
Hours I put in the Platimon so far (I forgot to count some days since I stopped caring): Around 151 hours. I wanted to do a 300-hour impression post, may do that if I am still motivated and remembered, but there is plenty of review on the Platimon already with a much better room setup and more realistic gear combination.
Wish it was more affordable, but it’s $11,000 USD plus sales tax. From looking only at the pictures on the website, it looks they just stack a Platimon VC One speaker to a giant floorstander.
From reading the description, these stand out to me:
VERSATILE SOUNDSTAGE
VC Two transcends traditional speaker boundaries by offering a full range of frequencies from 24Hz to 40,000Hz, ensuring every nuance of your music is faithfully reproduced. Despite its comprehensive sound capabilities, VC Two maintains a compact design, making it suitable for any living space. Experience the best of both worlds with VC Two’s harmonious blend of power and elegance.
Take control of your auditory journey with VC Two’s customizable features. Toggle the harmonic tweeter on and off with a convenient switch, and fine-tune its output using the intuitive 9-step adjustment switch. Tailor your listening experience to perfection, catering to your unique preferences and musical tastes.
DUAL SOUND PROFILES
Unleash the full potential of VC Two’s innovative crossover system, delivering not just one but two distinct sound profiles from a single speaker. From soothing symphonies to electrifying rhythms, immerse yourself in a world of sonic excellence with a speaker that adapts to your every mood and desire.
I don’t know what “Toggle the harmonic tweeter on and off with a convenient switch, and fine-tune its output using the intuitive 9-step adjustment switch.” means but I am looking forward to when a reviewer gets his hands on the Platimon VC Two and hopefully explaining that feature well.
I emailed a Mon Acoustic Rep to see if its possible to purchase just the floorstander since I already own a Platimon VC One. I am not planning on buying it anytime soon, but it would be nice to know the price and plan for future purchases.
Here is a link to a Youtube video of them talking about the Platimon VC two, but its in Korean with no English subs.
Just thinking out loud again:
About 3 months later using the Platimon VC One and it’s still really pleasant to hear this speaker. I still use my headphones for a quick 1 or 2-hour session when I feel too lazy to set up my listening space. I still very much enjoy using the Susvara, Onkyo A800, Sr1a, and Mysphere 3.2. Then, I finally got time to set up the listening space for a nice 3-5 hour speaker session and blew my mind every time. The clarity and details on the Platimon VC One are really nice while still sounding warm and full. I read an article on vocal EQ and they talked about for female vocals, around the 3 kHz is where the clarity or presence happen. Too much of it can make the female vocals sound harsh or overly bright. I put my ears on the AMT tweeter and clarity was really high, but it did sounded pretty harsh. Then I step back and the sound was perfectly balance again. The midrange woofer is 53 Hz to 3.1 kHz and the AMT tweeter is 3.1 kHz to 28 kHz and the speaker is MTM. The AMT tweeter clarity and details is amazing and the midrange woofer helps add that warmth and body to the vocals. I think the sound is nicely balanced without being too much or too little in the spectrum at least on my current setup. That makes things difficult if I ever replace anything in my setup, even cables because it could just mess up everything. I already know my next upgrade, just waiting for an opportunity. I will be focusing on the upper highs on this upgrade that won’t happen until maybe quarter 3 of the year if it ever comes in stock again.
I have been watching a lot of speaker reviews since that’s the closest thing to satisfying my curiosity about what other speakers may sound like. Honestly, almost none of the speakers description really grab my attention except for this one speaker that have been on my mind. I saw recent reviews on the Børresen X1 and X3. I would love to watch a comparison between the Børresen X1/X3 and the Platimon VC One/Two since they are very similar in pricing, but the sound signature goal seems pretty different from each other. The Børresen X1/X3 uses a ribbon tweeter while the Platimon VC One/Two uses an AMT tweeter. Maybe if I can find a used Børresen X1 with the stand, that would be a sweet comparison. I also just want to own 1 Børresen speaker just because I think that speaker seems really cool and for some reason manages to keep my attention on that speaker. But I want to make sure I am nearly finished with my setup before setting back my funds on another speaker. If anyone owns a Børresen X1/X3 speaker, would love to hear their opinion on it.
So I’ve been on YouTube a lot more and I saw this pop up my feed. Someone DM me Z reviews on the Platimon and I like how much praise he gave the Platimon.
On this video I just link, he mentioned that his recent reviews of the Platimon VC 1 have sold so much that they are having trouble keeping some in stock. And Z himself looks like is selling his stuff to keep the Platimon VC 1 in his collection.
I check some websites and the stock does seem smaller from Art Audio which I think used to have 3 or 2 in stock and now the Platimon just say one for each color.
I check the official US website and it looks like they no longer sell the stands. The speakers might still be in stock, but the stands option is no longer there. I think that is pretty interesting because the stands come with a cool isolation speaker feet with the Platimon speaker that I enjoy. Now if you want an “official” Mon Acoustic stand for the Platimon, you probably have to be the VC 2 which is like $11,000…
I’m pretty happy the Platimon VC 1 is selling nicely. That hopefully mean the company will continue to support the Platimon product in the future and I will get more people impressions of non reviewers view on the Platimon VC 1 in their system and room.
I kneel before the might of GaNFET Class D… My system currently is Mojo Audio Mystique Evo > Supratek 45 Cabernet Preamp > This Mighty Beast of GaNFET Class D (Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0) > (NRG 6:6 speaker cables) Platimon VC 1 is truly astonishing.
On this current chain, these 2 songs got me crying like a baby . Its the best I ever heard these two track and I am just filled with so much emotion from it.
I always gotta remember that this is a hobby and I should be buying equipment for my taste in music. The superb black background, the superb midrange clarity, and the highs with character. It is the final piece of my millennium puzzle!
This is for the song Aitakute (Piano & Strings Version): Open Qobuz
The moment when everything pauses in the music is when tears start building up in my eyes. Then she resumes. That happens in 1:18 - 1:19. It was only a second, but it impacted me and tears started tearing down when she resumed singing.
The black background really helps create this beautiful atmosphere for this track. A really quiet amp really take it to the next level for me in music. It makes me really glad I really enjoy 45 tubes in my system as the 45 tubes does help a lot in making the midrange much more musical without adding a lot of noise floor as a trade. I describe it better in past post of why its very important to me here:
^ Replace the Mysphere with this new Platimon setup because this is the best I ever heard that moment in the track.
Right now I was just doing a home demo of this GaNFET Class D amp just to see if GaNFET Class D would sound good in my system. I only had it for 2 days so far, but I took off work just to really listen to this amp which is probably around 8 hours a day, but of course I take breaks in between. Last 2 days, I was using test songs and thought it was a really good amp, but still wasn’t too sure if it is something I really want in my system. Today I just focus on my current favorite artist and songs and when the above-mentioned 2 songs came on… it sealed the deal. I want this amp to stay in my system, but its a demo so of course I got to give it back. I have until the week is up, so I will continue to test the amp with other genre until I have to give it to the next person.
I will probably post my 1 week impression with this amp combo with the Platimon when my demo session ends.
With all that said and done, time to go outside, touch some grass, and try to see if I can get a glimpse of the northern light tonight.
I was listening to Beethoven Pastoral (Karl Bohm 1971) yesterday and I was like F it. I currently in the process of selling my Susvara and Vidar 2 and will wait until I get enough fund for a newer version. I personally think the amp is a good all rounder where it isn’t too laid back or too forward. Its really neutral and played really well for both modern and classical music in my Platimon setup. My only complaint in my system is I want a wider soundstage for classical orchestra, but that’s really a room limitation/issue on my side. The soundstage is satisfying deeper in depth than my previous amp, the Vidar 2. But the Vidar 2 is really an equipment to make things work without sounding bad. Its a good amp, but Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 is just really nice (hate its long name though).
I am currently typing up last thoughts on my impression as I will either return the amp tomorrow or Wednesday. I will post it on both Steve Hoffman and probably here. In this forum, I will want to talk about the new version of Leo amps as he got a newer version coming soon, but its nothing too dramatic of a change. Just some small quality of life changes.
Well, I will go ahead and give the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp to the next person in line since I rarely have time to do a good listening session on the weekdays.
Both this post and my Steve Hoffman post is going to be kinda similar, but I can be more straightforward here and post more stuff about the Mon Acoustic Platimon since this is a Mon Acoustic Platimon thread. I can also just tell the whole story of my 1-month adventure here in this forum since it really started here on this rabbit hole of trying this Orchard Audio amp. The Steve Hoffman post will be just me summarizing my experience with the amp and trying my best to not derail that thread.
First off, thanks to Leo from Orchard Audio for that US Tour on his latest amp. That is really awsome that he did that so people like me that do not have any connections with local audio shops or people that don’t really go to any audio show to try a power amp at my very own home environment.
Next, thanks to @orrman for putting me on Z reviews of the Platimon which basically cause a chain and effect to this entire path I am taking:
This is the TLDR I got from the video on my first watch
" …its 40 minutes and I honestly kinda zone in and out during the review while eating some chicken. I might have missed a lot of what he said, but I think he said he likes the visceral bass, he likes the overall transparent clean sound, he likes the soundstage width, but he really loves how well the Platimon does phatom center imaging. I think half his video is talking about the soundstage width and phantom center imaging.
I think the most interesting thing he said in that review is a “country” sound signature. When I think of Korean gears it is pretty hard to describe. I wouldn’t go as far as what Z said in saying the Mon Acoustic speakers have no sound to them. I think as long the speaker has a cabinet, it has to have a sound. And the creator was trying to go for a Mpingo wood (African Blackwood) sound."
At first, I didn’t really agree on Z point of view of the Platimon sounding like “nothing” and that they are that transparent sounding speaker. Then he talked about how each country equipment kinda have its own sound signature and him describing the Platimon reminded of me trying to describe the Allnic HPA 5000XL headphone amp. Both these two Korean audio equipment don’t really sound like anything in the market to compare to and its truly unique in their own sound signature.
Then Z talked about how he wanted to pull his Platimon apart as far as he could because the width soundstage and the amazing phantom center imaging is really addicting on the Platimon. That I could relate to because I pretty much did the same thing on my Platimon where I pulled them apart as far as I could while keeping them away from the side walls.
Z started talking about how he strongly suggest no toe in for the Platimon because toeing in the Platimon will lose its “magic” on the width of the soundstage. Jay Iyagi (another reviewer) also mentioned that in his review that he recommended doing a little to no toe in with the Platimon for its magical soundstage width. So I did that and didn’t like how it sounded. I did some rearrangement on my room like getting rid of the computer desk (made it movable) and just remove the computer desk with the monitor outside the room when I am listening to the Platimon. Removing the computer desk from the room equation instantly made stage left sounds evenly clear with stage right. Did some more quality of life, added some more treatment on the back wall and now the Platimon sounded really good and I got that “magical” soundstage width with no toe-in Platimon. I think I experimented this during April. April had a lot of changes in the room itself and including tube changes in the preamp.
Long story short, I liked what Z suggested on the no toe in and how he like pulling the speakers apart like me. One thing I couldn’t get behind is putting the Platimon right against the wall because soundstage depth felt more disappointing to me doing that, but everyone room is different. My room, I like to pull it out at least 2.5 feet.
This is when I go deeper in the rabbit hole for Class D GanFet
Ok, so the seeds have been planted in my mind that Class D GanFet sounds amazing with the Platimon. Z was right about a lot of things when describing the Platimon. After rewatching his review video and I understand the true magic of No-Toe In Platimon, I got really curious on why he keep emphasizing that the Platimon sounds like nothing. The way Z describe the Platimon pair with the Orchard Audio Class D amp is kinda how I feel about the Mysphere 3.2 combo with the Allnic HPA-5000XL amp where its just you and the music. Where we say fuck the equipment, I just want to hear music unfilter without any equipment. Where the music just sound so natural that it just makes your brain think the performer is right here in the same room as they are really playing locally in your room. Next level of psychological fuckery for me. I snap my fingers like in the meme where Leonardo DiCaprio snap his fingers and points. I did that and said out loud, “I want that!”
After that, I started reading the official website on GanFet technology and the company beliefs and watching a lot of reviewers thoughts on the Orchard Audio GanFet Class D amp. I really like Jay Iyagi comparison video of the Orchard Audio GanFet Class D amp vs other amp he had in his possession. Bass quality seems like the highlight of the show for this Orchard Audio GanFet Class D amp while remaining very good clarity in the midrange and highs compared to other amps. Then I watched AbsoluteSound review on the Orchard Audio GanFet Class D amp and I like how he described the amp. He described it as a really good amp, especially for its clarity and dynamics, but is lacking the refinement in the highs that more expensive amps have which typically lives in the $10K plus area. Still craving for more impression to get that 1 review to really convince me on buying this amp, I kept searching the Internet. I came across the Steve Hoffman forum. They had a US tour thread and its “free” to join. The catch is you have to pay to ship to the next person and if anything goes wrong, you pay for shipping to the creator to get it fix. You also need a Steve Hoffman forum account so you can input your impression of the amp in that thread. 1 week also seem to be the maximum time to spend with the amp.
I signed up and waited for my turn…
Before going to the next segment, if you are curious on GanFet technology and how it greatly improve Class D amps of today times, here is a link from the Orchard Audio official website:
Time To Obtained The Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp For A Week
So the last person to have the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp is a local NC person. I coordinated with him and met up at a local Chinese restaurant because I wanted to eat some Hunan Chicken that day. So I met up with the guy and we talked a little bit. The guy seem pretty cool. His choice of speaker is a DIY GR research open baffle speaker paired with a REL subwoofer. Part of me wanted to say, “Wow, I want to hear one of those”, but I didn’t want to seem to friendly on someone I just met, I just that’s really cool. He paired his open baffle speaker with an all PS Audio setup I believe from DAC to amp. I don’t remember what PS Audio DAC and amp he had, but he told me he liked it better than the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp. I don’t remember too much, but he likes the soundstage width and midrange better on his PS Audio amp vs the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp. Then he suggested to me to try out the PS Audio amp if I could as he really respect their products. He ask me on whats my setup and I told him Mystique Evo DAC (seem like he didn’t know), Supratek DHT Preamp (seem like he didn’t know either), and the Platimon speaker. When I said Platimon speaker, he told he know that one and its a really good sounding speaker. When he said that, that made me physically smile and I became much more friendlier. I don’t know if he was being nice, but I like hearing that for some reason. I guess ownership pride or something. We chatted a little bit more and he told me one thing that really stood out to him his bass on the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp. I don’t remember exactly what he said, but he told me when drums hit, it shook his room or something with the REL subwoofer on and his room is fully treated. For some tracks, he felt the REL subwoofer really got loud even though the volume is always it have been on his setup. That got me thinking that the first thing I want to test is bass. Then he told me that when he got the amp during shipping from the last person from him, it got damaged from shipping and he had to send the amp to Leo. There was a channel distortion issue on one of them and Leo was able to quickly fix it and send it back to the person in line. I note to myself that I will put a lot of bubble warps on the amp before sending it to the next person. I said my goodbye, put the amp in my car and drove home.
Testing the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp in my setup
My setup in my small room:
ROON Rock - Intel NUC 7i7 > EMM Labs NS1 > [Silver Sonic D-110 AES] Mojo Audio Mystique EVO B4B 21 > [Audience Ohno XLR] Custom 45/6SN7 Tube Only Supratek Cabernet DHT > [Enoaudio Mogami 2534 Quad Pair (L,R) Cable | Neutrik XLR Female - XLR Male] Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp > [NRG The 6:6 Custom Speaker Cable] Mon Acoustics Platimon VC One
There was a little rattle sound coming from inside the amp when I received it and I email Leo about it. I opened the case and took pictures for him to see. The little rattle from inside the amp was a loose screw and I made sure every part is soldered in and to double check if there is any loose screw in the amp. I reported none and the sound quality is good on my end. I discarded the loose screw from inside the amp and closed it. I made sure to turn it off and unplug it when I open it and test the sound quality after closing it.
First impression on looking at the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp is that this amp is really huge from what I heard class D is is supposed to be. I heard class D are small foot print amps with really good temperature control. The Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp is cool to the touch, but man is this a huge amp at least compare to all the amps I have currently. I will call it the Starkrimson at this point for the sake of my sanity. The Starkrimson is the size of both my Allnic headphone amp and Schiit Vidar 2 side by side. The Starkrimson is comparable in size to my Mystique Evo DAC. When I open it the amp up, it was filled with parts. The sheer size of the Starkrimson already is telling me this isn’t your typical class D amp.
Day 1
I used the Decibal X app on my phone to measure my db and frequency in my room, so you can take it with a grain of salt when I mentioned it.
First listen was Arabella Steinbacher take on Four Seasons and Symphony Fantastique. During this time, I am just listening for upgrade on clarity and as a lot of reviewers rage on about midrange clarity. To my ears on the first couple of testing tracks, the clarity jump from the Vidar 2 to the Starkrimson didn’t seem huge. It sounded less grainy and compressed compared to the Vidar 2, but the overall clarity didn’t really make me say wow yet… I would say the midrange clarity is a step rather than a jump to me which makes sense to me as clarity from my headphone amp, my Raal SR1a setup, memories of other expensive headphone amp in audio show, to the Platimon + Vidar 2 with Supratek Preamp were pretty close to each other and I always get the impression the Platimon was just a cleaner sounding equipment overall. Also, I really can’t imagine it get clearer than this, cause its basically real life, which I will talk about more in Day 3.
I moved on to synthesize bass tracks to test the bass. The lowest frequency I was able to get the Platimon to reach was 46hz which isn’t too different from my Vidar 2. The average db I listened to for this section is I always wanted to keep it under 80db cause I don’t want to become too deaf. I think I turned the music to average around 76db. The highest peak was 97.1db while the lowest db was 41 which is probably when the music is off lol. I will admit, I never noticed it went that high until I looked at the Decibal X app. One thing that the Starkrimson amp started to amaze me is that it can go that high while still sounding really clear. Another thing is bass sounds more controlled, cleaned, and somehow fuller than the Vidar 2 even though they both seem to drop off at 46hz. The Vidar 2 imo exaggerates bass or more specifically midbass on my system into sounding more impactful than it really is. The Starkrimson amp doesn’t exaggerate bass to me. When the bass needs to get loud, it will get loud. If the bass does not get loud it will stay that way. The Starkrimson amp gives me the impression that its more truer to the recording. Bass never felt overpowering no matter how loud it gets and it always felt like the Starkrimson amp is in control because the bass sounded clean always. The test songs that I remember quite clearly was all Jmusic synth songs like Myth and Roid Remembrance and Forever Lost Songs and Syudou I’m A Ghost Type song.
Day 2
Sorry, I’m getting really lazy and tired already of typing lol. Day 2, I shuffle the list with random songs to get in the mood and started focusing on female vocals with acoustic and small ensembles. Nothing really click so far with the Starkrimson amp and me yet. Tried more bass focus songs and then listen to one of my favorite EP of 2024 cause I got tired of listening to test songs. Then I went to modern rap songs and then rock songs from the 70s, 80s and 90s. With the old rock songs, I wanted to test if the Starkrimson amp could redeem some songs for me because the Vidar 2 + Platimon combo made the recording sound more compressed to me (don’t know if that is the right word, but I want to yes). One of the songs were Guns N Roses Sweet Child O’ Mine and Ozzy Osborne Crazy Train. To my surprise, they sounded pretty dang good with the Platimon now. So I digged deeper and deeper and Yes Roundabout song got me really liking the Starkrimson amp + Platimon combo. I stop writing notes on Day 2 during a session and was just going through my favorites music at that point when I stop doing “test” songs. After the Roundabout song is over, I had the urged to play Led Zeppelin Stairway to Heaven song. Again, didn’t write notes, but I remember smiling a lot and remembering how awesome that song is. I kept going through the genre and then switch to Dragon Force Through the Fire and Flames. That was the most amazing experience I had with that song in any setup. That phrase will be a trend, you will hear me say holy crap that most amazing experience I had with that song on any setup with the Starkrimson + Platimon combo. At that point, I started my search for something else which was speed. Around 4:00 - 6:05 in the song Through the Fire and Flames, the speed and maintained clarity is really insane. I felt cracked out not that I would know what crack feels like, but I think it think it would feel like this based on what I use as an alternative which is Celsius. Next, I played the Band Maid on my 2 favorite album which is Unseen World and Unleash. No God and Black Hole was the two tracks I really wanted to focus on, but I was F it, I wanted to listen to the whole 2 albums. The kick drums didn’t really shake up the room. But with those speed, it got my heart pumping more bpm to the song (its an exaggeration I hope). Day 2, I learned the Starkrimson amp + Platimon combo, they got a really addicting speed with no blur and all clarity.
Day 3
This day is pretty important as this day seal the deal for me on the Starkrimson. Day 1, I appreciated the bass sound quality. Day 2, I appreciated the speed, attack, and maintained clarity. I’ve been holed up in my house for too long, let me talk to a human being again to restore my humanity. When talking to a real human being again, it got me thinking that maybe I’ve been chasing for the nonexistent clarity this entire time. After my quick hang out, I returned home to resume the listening session. I thought I would do something different. I live pretty much isolated, let me take advantage of that. I turned off the AC and managed to get the room quietest db which was 22.9db according to the app. I learned from yesterday session to just play songs I really like and remember those songs from the heart and compare it to the present of whats in front of me. No notes, just straight listening session and absorbed the experience. I played shuffle on my favorite playlist to get in the mood and started listening to my current favorite artist discography which is Ado who is a Japanese Utaite singer. Listen to most of her songs from cover to original and it got to my 2 favorite songs (which I purposely put them side by side). I posted it in the heat of the moment in this thread, so I will just paste it below:
Basically on that day, I fell in love the the Starkrimson amp + Platimon for recreating such a breathtaking atmosphere on those tracks. With its perfect silence, its more than usual black background to really emphasize the space in the instruments and Ado vocals. The emotional rollercoaster I feel when Ado sings throughout the track. And most of all, I think I finally understood what Z was talking about in his review. Where we can say fuck the equipment, all that really matter is the music and the listener. A moment created thanks to the Starkrimson amp + Platimon combo that makes it so memorable. It really feels like a real private concert because the realism factor is really kicking in my brain. That’s how real it sounded to me. Then I started going back and listening to other female vocals with acoustic and small ensembles and my brain just finally click with it. Everything just sounds amazing to me now.
Day 4
So I started listening to classical orchestra again since my brain finally clicked on female vocals and this time just really focus on enjoying the music. The timbre on every instruments is amazing, the hyper focus imaging combine with the Starkrimson amp added clarity made layering and imaging so easy. The soundstage depth I was actually pretty surprised. It felt really deep like the soundstage itself is about the size of 5 rows while I am still a couple rows back from the front. My only complaint is the soundstage width. I wish I could match its great depth with a great width, but its just physically impossible in my current room setting or maybe I should play more with Diffusors on side stage placement. When Karl Bohm Beethoven Pastoral started playing I just felt at peace. Its been 2 years since I heard Pastoral live and this is one of the more amazing experience I ever felt from that digital recording. Keep in mind that I turned off the AC and my room isn’t torturing hot. The lowest db is 22.9 when the music is off. When Pastoral piece came on, I did pull up the app because I was interested in the dynamics. The lowest db when the piece is being played is around 33db, the average is 50db-60db, and the highest peak was 84.9db. Dynamics is freaking amazing with the Pastoral Piece and Starkrimson amp + Platimon speaker combo. So everything I started appreciating from Day 1 to Day 3 comes together to Day 4.
Day 4 is over and I watched some TV shows like the newest episode of Demon Slayers the Hashira Training Arc about 50 minute episode. Its over, I really want this amp in my system lol.
CONCLUSION?
There is no way I can post this at the official forum for the US tour. Too much not needed details, but it was fun typing this out. I will probably make a super easy digestible version in the official forum of the world tour that just get straight to the point but at the same time a huge water down version.
I already sold my Susvara and Schiit Vidar 2. All I am waiting now is just more F U Funds to build up before officially buying this amp. I talked to Leo and he told me there is a 2.5 version of the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC power amp. 2.5 version is just a built in RCA to XLR converter as the amp itself can only use XLR inputs.
I like the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp because to me, its a very versatile amp for different music genre. The Starkrimson + Platimon plays very well with both modern music and classical music because of its amazing dynamics, amazing black background, and its overall top to bottom clarity with no weird hiccup. Because of its lack of coloration and added flavor to my chain, it really let my 45 tube preamp shine. As people describe the Starkrimson, its just a straight wire with gain type of amp. The more I tune my preamp to my preference, the Starkrimson amp will let my audio chain truly shine.
I guess that’s it from me. I think the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp pairs really nicely with the Mon Acoustic Platimon VC One only if your current audio chain reach to your satisfaction or at least nearly to your satisfaction. The Starkrimson is not a miracle worker, but it truly rewards people that really enjoy their current audio chain.
Sweet Summary of the above lengthy above post
I made a TLDR version and posted it to the official Starkrimson US Tour thread at the Steve Hoffman forum as feedback is required for the US tour. It’s not really a TLDR since its still pretty lengthy, but its a “shorten” summarized version. I thought I would paste it here as well since the post is very lengthy. So here is the sweet summary of my Starkrimson experience with the Platimon:
First off, thank you Leo from Orchard Audio for that US Tour on his latest amp. That was really awesome that he did that for people like me who do not have any connections with local audio shops or people who don’t go to any audio show to try a power amp in my very own home environment. This was an amazing experience and I think it is safe to say I might be considering the Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC power amp in my future.
My setup in my small room:
ROON Rock - Intel NUC 7i7 > EMM Labs NS1 > [Silver Sonic D-110 AES] Mojo Audio Mystique EVO B4B 21 > [Audience Ohno XLR] Custom 45/6SN7 Tube Only Supratek Cabernet DHT > [Enoaudio Mogami 2534 Quad Pair (L,R) Cable | Neutrik XLR Female - XLR Male] Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp > [NRG The 6:6 Custom Speaker Cable] Mon Acoustics Platimon VC One
Tubes used on my 45/6SN7 Tube Only Supratek Cabernet DHT Preamp: (2) RCA Globe 45 Tube, (2) RCA 6SN7 Tube, (2) RCA 6L6GC Tube, and (1) RCA 5U4G Tube.
My original amp currently in the system is a Schiit Vidar 2 and I was looking between the Starkrimson and another class AB amp as my next upgrade for the Platimon setup. The Schiit Vidar 2 is what I would call a reliable amp that lets my speaker play without me worrying too much about sound quality. But after upgrading to the Platimon, I could tell that it was the bottleneck of the chain.
My listening and speaker position:
7.4 feet from the listening position to the speakers
About 7 feet the speakers are apart from each other.
Both speakers are about 2.5 feet away from the side wall and front wall
No toe in as I enjoy a more wide and flesh-out dimensional soundstage with the Platimon VC 1.
My first impression looking at the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp is that this amp is huge from what I heard class D is supposed to be. I heard class D is small footprint amps with great temperature control. The Starkrimson is cool to the touch, but man is this a huge amp at least compared to all the amps I have currently have. The Starkrimson is the size of both my Allnic HPA-5000XL headphone amp and Schiit Vidar 2 side by side. The Starkrimson is comparable in size to my Mystique Evo DAC. The sheer size of the Starkrimson is already telling me this isn’t your typical class D amp.
Let’s start with the Positive:
No harsh highs (No Sibilance or anything of that sort in my system)
Very Clear Mids
Great Black background that really helps create the atmosphere of the track for me (which is my highlight of the amp for me)
Very nice and clean-sounding bass
Very good side stage imaging and phantom center imaging (probably thanks to the blacker background that it’s much easier to paint the picture of the track)
You can turn the volume to a very high volume (90db) and the quality does not degrade (but honestly your ears will if you listen to that volume for a period of time). I think this is very good for a lot of classical orchestra music and maybe electric music as well since they have a lot of dynamics in their piece that sometimes raise the volume significantly from time to time. The highest peak I had was around 97db, but my average was 76db in one of my sessions and that was on a “Bring Home The Bass Playlist” (My personal bass playlist). When I was playing Karl Bohm Beethoven Pastoral, I turned off the air conditioning and now the lowest db is 22.9 when the music is off. The lowest db when the piece is being played is around 33db, the average is 50db-60db, and the highest peak is 84.9db. Dynamics is freaking amazing with the Pastoral Piece and Starkrimson amp + Platimon speaker combo. When I turn off the air conditioning, my room still remains pretty cool as I remember my feet feeling a little chilly. My other equipment like my preamp and DAC doesn’t really produce too much heat.
Very fast speed and very good at maintaining clarity. Around 4:00 - 6:05 in the song Through the Fire and Flames by Dragon Force, the speed and maintained clarity is really insane. I felt cracked out not that I would know what crack feels like, but I think it think it would feel like this based on what I use as an alternative which is Celsius. Next, I played the Band Maid on my 2 songs, No God and Black Hole was the two tracks. The kick drums didn’t really shake up the room. But with that speed, it got my heart pumping more bpm to the song (it’s an exaggeration I hope). I learned with the Starkrimson amp + Platimon combo, they got a really addicting speed with no blur and all clarity.
Depth has gotten much better in my setup. It felt like the soundstage itself was about the size of 5 rows while I was still a couple of rows back from the front. My only complaint is the soundstage width. I wish I could match its great depth with a great width, but it’s just physically impossible in my current room setting or maybe I should play more with Diffusors on side stage placement.
I really do not have any negative things to say about the Starkrimson amp if you know what you are going into about this amp. If I have to say something bad, it’s more a complaint of the cosmetic feature which is the really bright blue LED light. I like to listen to music in the dark sometimes for full immersion and that blue LED light do stick out like a sore thumb. It’s easily fixed by placing my wallet in front of it and going back to the listening session so it’s really not a big deal.
The Starkrimson is just a really solid amp overall and I can’t find any fault pair with the Platimon VC 1 speaker. I also used it with my R2R DAC with the Supratek Cabernet DHT preamp using RCA Globe 45 tube, so the Starkrimson was getting amazing musicality as the source and all the Starkrimson had to do was focus on bringing the best out of my speaker.
I like the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp in my setup because to me, it’s a very versatile amp for different music genres. The Starkrimson + Platimon plays very well with both modern music and classical music because of its amazing dynamics, amazing black background, and its overall top-to-bottom clarity with no weird hiccup. Because of its lack of coloration and added flavor to my chain from the Starkrimson, it really let my 45-tube preamp shine. As people describe the Starkrimson, its just a straight wire with gain type of amp and I agree with that statement. The more I tune my preamp to my preference, the Starkrimson amp will let my audio chain truly shine. I think the Orchard Audio Starkrimson Stereo Ultra DMC 2.0 power amp pairs really nicely with the Mon Acoustic Platimon VC One only if your current audio chain reaches your satisfaction or at least nearly to your satisfaction. The Starkrimson is not a miracle worker, but it truly rewards people who really enjoy their current audio chain and want to bring out the best of your system without introducing more “flavor” to the audio chain.
I saw he toe in the Platimon on his setup and use isoacoustic isolation feet instead of the ball bearing feet. I thought I would try toe in the Platimon again since my room treatment is much better this time around.
I treated the 1st reflection, 2nd reflection, and back wall. I use the mirror trick to treat the 1st and 2nd reflection.
So the Platimon is still about 6.5 feet apart from each other and I’m a little further from 6.5 feet further from my listening seat to the speakers. Speakers are still about 3 feet away from the side and front walls. Back wall is treated as well, but the paint came off when I removed the foam treatment I had there before I replaced it with the bass monster traps . Masking tape is my friend, so I know that for that in the future.
Long story short, I don’t really hear a difference anymore from no toe in vs toe in besides soundstage. Timbre sound pretty much the same and clarity and detail don’t seem too different anymore. The only difference is toe-in sounds worse to me because the soundstage sounds more “contained”. While in no toe-in, the Platimon sounds so much more expressive because soundstage just opens up much more to me. Both toe-in and no toe-in have excellent phantom center stage, but toe-in loses it holographic soundstage nature to me. Also in some songs with no toe-in, mostly modern jpop songs, I do get this cool soundstage where it feels like the side walls became my speakers and it’s a really good feeling. Since I don’t really get anymore benefit from toe-in, I will keep it no-toe in unless I go another dramatic change in my speaker setup in terms of positioning and I am forced to use toe-in for some reason. Disclaimer as well that this is what I hear for my current room on the Platimon VC One. Everyone experience is going to be different if they need to toe in or not, so always experiment!
Lesson learned, room treatment and speaker placement is too important to ignore. If ignored, so much potential wasted, just like everyone says. I will say that toe-in did reduce the “room” effect, so it did gave me a good idea of what the Platimon sound potential could be when I didn’t have room treatment and it did motivate to keep trying on room treatment because of how much I loved the no toe-in sound of the Platimon during that time.
Next step, corner bass traps and clouds for room treatment. After that, new audio rack because I want to move the preamp somewhere else. I’m really curious on diffusion, but maybe when everything is done or a new speaker room. A side note, I really love having a remote . I had a remote with the Supratek and haven’t use it until I made the big changes maybe like 9 months ago. Being able to control the volume from without getting up is really nice.
About 9 months have passed since I first gotten the Platimon VC One speakers. It still the best thing I ever heard and it’s just keep getting better with all my additional changes from speaker placement to room treatment to new tube rolling. Because I been slowly making those changes, I’ve been enjoying the journey and really appreciating each changes I’ve made. It’s been a long 9 months and I enjoyed every weekend with the Platimon. Even though it’s been 9 months, the journey is still far from over. It’s going to be a while for the next change because corner bass traps are probably the most expensive one for room treatment. Looking forward to what the next change will do to the Platimon.
I don’t see much discussion of the SuperMon Mini on this thread. I’m considering these as a desktop speaker: where they will be on either side of a computer monitor and about 1.5-2.5 feet away from me.
I understand that this distance is “too close” for even most nearfield monitors, but I have read good things of the Minis in this configuration. My (tube) amp is an LTA Ultralinear+ (20Wpc).
I wonder how this would compare to an Omega Compact Alnico or some LS3/5a speaker, for this use-case? I’d love other suggestions too. The only reason for considering the Omegas is that the UL+ is supposed to be better with more sensitive speakers.
I do plan to get a sub in any case, and of course proper isolation from the desk.
I don’t think anybody here owned the Super Mon Mini with the exception of maybe one person. I have not heard of the Super Mon Mini yet, but it is on my bucket list to hear as it looks to be a scale down version of their TOTL speaker, The SuperMon Isobaric as both speakers are configured as 2.5 isobaric. I’m sure a lot of people owned the Omega brand speakers before, so you can easily get more impressions on that.
Your own preference is what really matter at the end of the day. I say for people to provide you a better suggestion on speakers, you should probably say what kind of headphones you listen to and what genre on music this is going to be used for (in the main speaker thread). If you live in SoCal, you can probably book a demo session at the main company American Branch Mon Acoustic and demo the Super Mon Mini. You can bring your amp there to make sure it synergize well.
Agree with Saberpunch, trust YOUR ears but listen to advice on people when they steer you towards known good synergistic pairings.
In the world of near field the 20 watts on the LTA is WAY more than you’ll ever need so no need to worry about that. The Omegas are a nice natural fit for the LTA.
In my experience however concentric or single point drivers do well near field as they allow for a greater sweet spot.
The really nice thing about near field is that you for the most part, take the room out of the equation so you’re really just left with the speaker itself and how it will perform near a wall. Recommend front facing port BTW.
. Its the best I ever heard these two track and I am just filled with so much emotion from it.
. Masking tape is my friend, so I know that for that in the future.
. I had a remote with the Supratek and haven’t use it until I made the big changes maybe like 9 months ago. Being able to control the volume from without getting up is really nice.