So the sound quality difference would be mostly because of the server or player functions?
Assuming the server isnât the player, and isnât close enough to impact the player with stray RF, itâs somewhat irrelevant how much work it has to do.
The different protocols can cause differing loads on the players, DLNA and Squeeze, the server just serves the compressed audio to the player over http, there should be little to no difference there, the player will fill whatever buffer it has (either at the OS level or whatever itâs managing locally) decompress it, likely into another buffer and probably just point itâs,output device at the bits.
Who knows what RAAT does, the server likely does the decompression, and sends raw bits, from the network traffic someone else posted Iâd guess it might be using a number of buffers in a circular fashion on the client, and requesting them as necessary rather relying on the networks stack, and tcp/ip streaming. Whether that cause more or less load or more or less uneven load itâs hard to guess.
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My very non scientific findings is that there is some correlation to cpu load. Roon roon sounded the worst, squeeze squeeze sounded the best and roon squeeze was an okay medium. The differences widened when i got my raidho. It became enough for me to not return to roon just for the ui
I guess it also depends on how strong the CPU is in your gear. Iâm currently running ROCK from the NUC but canât seem to find a way for the S30 to be running just the player. At least it has minimal compute demand from the server software running on it.
and thatâs the issue at itâs core. These devices were not designed for Roon in mind, then Roon comes along and theyâre trying to make it work. Innuous did the right thing IMO by just saying it wonât work and it sounds better using our SW and thatâs that. If youâve got a device thatâs designed to both serve and play then the lowest noise (usually low power CPU) is ideal but itâs not ideal to do what Roon requires. ROCK or Roon Server handle the CPU load to handle the RAAT transfer, apply any sound processing and handle the service duties for potentially multiple simultaneous streams.
What would be interesting to hear is what results you get with your Antipodes trio when youâre using Rock to play and the Antipodes as a basic Roon endpoint to where itâs not doing the heavy lifting. Unless thatâs what youâre trying to test in the first place and I havenât been keeping up.
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That is what Iâm doing now but the S30 insists on acting as a secondary server that I couldnât get to turn off yet. My ROCK is mimicking an additional S40 basically.
I just posted a question in their support community board letâs see what they say. The S30 can be only a player if I had a S40. Seems weird to not allow it if you have a ROCK.
No so weird, itâs designed as an ecosystem. Definitely share whatever response you might get. Also might be worth asking the question on the Roon forum but that place is a shit show of bits are bits people who will question your question in the first place. lol
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When I had a s30 i thought there was a drop down in one of the settings for 3 different setups (player) (server) or (player/sever) iirc
Found it!
It was called Source and you set it to None instead of S30 under the Player main menu. That shuts down the server function completely. Donât know how I missed that tbh lol
Itâs a weird UX decision though since I was looking for a turn off option in the Server menus.
If you want to turn off the Player you set the player app to None. I wouldâve expected it to be similar on the server side.
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Some quick thoughts on my semi new to me S30/20/60 stack and a comparison between it and the LPS modded Lumin U1 miniâŚ
I have had the Anitpodes stack for about a month now and itâs been pretty neat. Off the bat I donât know if I would recommend going to this level if your main music comes from Streaming or even if you pull it off a NAS. There is such a difference between the same songs being streamed vs them playing off local storage. This isnt just an Antipodes thing but, the benefits you get here really come through more. I do not have a fancy power or ethernet set up, it is wired directly to a Mesh node that I need to get any connectivity to the area. Maybe I could move that node out of the room, but I am not trying to do too much.
I also battle allergies and ear inflammation starting mid-march and going until the middle/end of summer. Everything just feels flattened and lessened. I can get the feel of things but dimension is lost, tactility and texture is softened, and bass and treble is hit or miss. This varies by the day but I try not to go by one dayâs thoughts.
Lastly, the Lumin was connected to my DACs mostly with a Cardas Clear USB, or a borrowed DH Labs AES. The Antipodes has only been with the Cardas connecting to the S20 DDC and a Snake River Boomslang BNC/RCA Spdif from there to the DAC. I tried to go usb straight for a more 1:1 but it just did not want to work on the antipodes. That is decent bit of variance outside of just the sources but not much I can help here.
The Antipodes S-Stack:
The overall feel really does have that natural, and easy flowing thing going on. I donât think I would call it rounded but there is definitely more heft to the lower and mid ranges. Allergies affect my bass perception the most, even at times neutralizing it, but I can still tell there was more weight. It is all an agile weight though as it keeps up and doesnât add bloat, get too rich, or try to strong arm anything forward. Mids on the Studio B were initially pretty dry/parched/thin especially coming from a decware and the Radu amp. Not sure if it is me getting more used to it but I did take steps to help out (tubes, dac) and I think going from lumin to antipodes may have tilted it to the more sweet full side without loosing other great qualities. So much so I would be interested in hearing the more linear 300Bs in the amp vs the WEs (thinking EMLs). The Studio B still keeps treble presence and it does not come across as sharp or extremely defined now. It is more aired out. I donât want to say softer or rounded. Perhaps smoother, but it just feels more eased and aired out. Maybe relaxed is the best way to explain it or less direct. I want to listen to a bit more music and sound files that emphasize that treble attack. Some songs have rain effects in them, and those tend to give a great idea of the smacks and the pops that pluck in your ears.
UI wise I am using LMS/Squeeze and I have been enjoying it, more than Luminâs stock stuff. This doesnt mean it has been flawless but I will get to that later. I really like some of the extra apps included. I use some of the FLAC internet radio stations to keep things rolling, there are tons of plug ins which i keep to the minimum, but it all follows a flow you would expect.
Lumin U1 Mini w/ LPS:
Off the bat I enjoy the one tidy sized box a bit more as well as the screen giving you some info. Sonically, you get a much different presentation for the Antipodes. It is more about the technicalities. I would say where the Antipodes is a little more golden, natural and easy going. Think of looking at the horizon off a clean, white sand beach during a golden sunset. The Lumin is flat-ish FR âneutralâ, crisp, and gives a bigger voice to the minutia. Think of a NASA photo taken of Earthâs horizon from space, where there is a clean and crisp delineation of our blue and green globe against the black of space. Tiny details are more forward and there is overall a clean, sometimes crystalline type quality. It all stays musical. I never thought it to be fatiguing or giving up the fun in favor of being analytical. It has great separation and associated âblacknessâ, which while I am a sucker for separation I can see some thinking this is over emphasized. The Antipodes probably has a blacker background but it is handled different. The Lumin almost puts a highlighted outline around objects and between it all is a black void that sucks everything in, which leads to even more emphasis and almost a spotlights what is there. The Antipodes does it different, and is a bit harder to describe. I think it lets the main pieces speak louder in the mix and is not afraid to let things fall way way way back. Think of a moonless night and youâre deep in the forest, you fire up a torch and those things immediately around you are lit up well. Beyond that you can still see many levels of trees but eventually there is still a pitch black background past a certain distance. The torchâs light doesnât do anything to brighten up those layers further out, it illuminates what it can, if it even reaches. I want to try a newer Aurender (N20) as i think it may be a nice bridge between the Lumin and itâs emphasized technicalities and the naturalness of the Antipodes.
UI wise I dont think the Lumin was bad. It worked, and I only used it off the USB as there is no internal storage but the app loved to freeze and needed multiple force stops during a session. I figured out the nuances and go album artwork to present correctly but it was all mehhhh. I will not go too deep here as this is all in the Lumin thread and I do not want to retype. I will say they are the only ones to have the embedded track art show in the explorer not only per track, but it would trickle up to albums and artists. In the end the mehh UI and no real local storage pushed me to change things up.
Antipodes Issues:
For the life of me I cannot get it to just play out of the USB, i tried a bunch but decided to punt this until i need to output usb to the Lampi which who the hell knows when that will be next. I also dont like the server > ddc > dac and extra steps and everything not being in one box. I think it kills some of the personality of say the callisto or boomslang, it is more cables, more complication. When I swapped out my USB (btw the usb port in the back is shit) it seemed to break the unit as well, long story short settings were not taking and the interface was freezing so I ended up clearing the database a few times, reinstalling Squeeze, and wiping the hard drive and starting from scratch. But it was a pain redoing all plugins and settings and reloading the library. It also really doesnt like change. Shutting off or putting it in standby, changing cables, router restarts, anything really upsets it and it takes more effort than I like to get it back going.
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I should have added to the above, for a known relatable reference point, i get that RNHP type vibe from the antipodes. Obviously different equipment with different jobs, but both seem content on letting things just be and do whatever theyre going to do. I do not want to say realistic, as i think that is more fooling yourself something is really there, but I guess this is that natural, or organic sway people often get from these pieces.
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Great write up thank you for sharing!
This was in the physical magazine earlier this month, full article now online:
Another one from HFA, if you are interested.
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From on of the review posts:
âThere is an increasing level of interest in Antipodes offering its own playback solution that includes making powerful DSP functionality,â Jenkins said. âBut that would only address the user interface layer. Instead, we are developing a new full stack, which integrates the player user interface, the user management interface, the orchestration layer, the operating system, and the firmware. We have two objectives: sound quality and ease of use. We plan to deliver a simplified version later this year, and the complete version in 2024.â
Tbh just give me a sweet LMS skin with an antipodes colorway.
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A little update to my impressions. Last week i had a session where my ears felt better, and i think I turned the corner on what I call the âpollen and pressureâ season.
Antipodes â Mojo Mystique X â Studio B â LCD-2.2pf. Yes, I have âbetterâ headphones but this is what I am most familiar with.
First thing, I was able to hear more seperation and definitive placement. Everything in the mix was more clearly in their own space. Once again, not superficial at all like the Lumin, but very naturally. There is also more minutia to the depth in all directions, not just front to back straight on dead center but also as it circles out left and right.
I can hear the dynamics better, still appropriate and not over the top. Nothing like a Schiit BF2 system where you get the big, big macro swings, but it will go there only if the music takes it there. (Ex: Seal - Kiss from a Rose, when the backing orchestra revs up). Bass is solid, solid, solid, and meaty. Satisfyingly thumpy! Itâs just nice to hear this again and to not have allergy ears suppressing it.
Really impressive was the texture and tactility, even on an LCD-2.2pf which some trusted sources denote as texture light. It really scratches an itch that can be hard to reach. The scratch of steel guitar strings, the sizzle of snares, the brightness a backing tamborine adds, its all there in spades. And how it all pokes and hits your ears kept me hooked for a few hours, I was back to feeling those little âpopsâ rain makes in person but on tracks. It really had me leaning more towards acoustic music overall just as it really promotes those attributes and theyre not hidden behind effects, overdrives, etc.
And maybe this is where I tilt and say it starts sounding "realistic"â˘. Oh itâs not going to have anyone here close their eyes and convince them they are actually there, but elements are in place and the organic, natural lean can help fool you a little.
Right now i think the deficit in my system is just the micro detail. I dont think this is on the antipodes. Perhaps the dac is the issue here as some of that âwent awayâ when I upgraded, I would like to try an SE, or maybe the Audeze are just at their outright limit. But if i keep getting sessions like this I can look past that all.
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Just finished a remote session with Antipodes.
I couldnât get it to upgrade to the latest firmware so set up an appointment through their website.
Sitting in front of my Mac watching them go through it, took 20min because I think the network was a little slow but he basically SSHed into both server and player computers and upgraded both, then ran squeeze and roon to make sure sound is playing and wrapped up.
I made sure to delete the software and all its permissions but this was straightforward, convenient and completely free.
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Agree their support is fantastic - Im based in AU but had an issue with my unit early on and jumped off the support call, got the dhl shipping tag and it picked up in the same day. Returned within 10 days.
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Anyone pondering the upgrade?
New antipodes software (v5) which is supposed to be a very big upgrade is confirmed for end of January 2024 release
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