I would consider my system in the middle of entry-level (I would guestimate around $1k). Recently, I got a new job with considerably higher pay, and so my goals for saving have shifted to what would be a $10k+ system.
I imagine most of you have also made it out of the entry-level world. What were lessons you learned (positive or negative) as you went up the ladder into hifi?
You realy realy just need to hear a bunch of shit. No amount reading can make you actualy understand a review as much as having just heard some stuff in the same tier and comparing against that. Its hard to talk about sound and that means (for me at least) stuff like “more detail” “more texture” and “better timbre” didn’t truly have a meaning in my mind until I experienced a few different tiers of each.
I feel like I’m cheating a bit since I’ve been in the higher end side of things since I can remember since my family and friends were always into higher end, but ignoring that:
If this shit isn’t fun, you are doing it wrong and something needs to change, personally the best goal for this hobby is enjoyment imo
Being open minded will get you pretty far, being closed minded will not
It’s fine to like gear as much as music, but if you start only focusing too heavily on one aspect it might lead to dissatisfaction down the line
The only way to truly know what something sounds like is to listen to it, there are no shortcuts (sound demo’s, measurements, guesses based off other things, etc tend to not really show much in comparison)
Trusting your own ears will lead you down the best path, do what’s right for you, not someone else
Don’t ignore your own preferences
A hifi system will not touch the realism of an actual live performance, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be equally enjoyable
Something that looks good on paper doesn’t mean it will sound good in practice
Don’t rush into things, take slower steps, don’t jump multiple tiers in one go, enjoy the hobby to the fullest lol
Sometimes there are no true upgrades, and you are better off improving what you already have instead of trying to recreate an entirely new setup
“Snake Oil” is much less common then you think, but that doesn’t mean every product makes sense for your setup or will improve your setup
Trying to objectivity a subjective hobby is only a waste of time and saps any enjoyment you have left
Hype/FOTM is seldom worth investing in, wait and let the dust settle before considering, can save you down the line
Buy used, it almost always give more positive benefits than negative
Learn from your negative experiences and use them to guide you toward more positive ones
Sometimes you just need time with something to understand it, don’t make rash discussions, sometimes things either need time or adjustments to get them where you want them to be
Generalized statements typically don’t hold up or have enough exceptions to where they may mislead (heh)
As you move up, it becomes much more difficult to explain what you are hearing in words
Sadly, generally, you get what you pay for, it’s uncommon that isn’t the case
There really isn’t such a thing as diminishing returns, but there is such a thing as a reasonable stopping point, and that will differ from person to person
Sometimes experimenting with trial and error is the best approach
Try to not get stuck in sidegrading hell, make meaningful upgrades not marginal if you are going to upgrade imo
Listening is a skill, and it needs to be developed with time and experience
Listen to music you actually like, not what only sounds good in your system, make sure you enjoy what you listen to
Try to get at least lossless for a high performing system
High res is not always better
Mastering is extremely important
Explore other or new genre, try out new music, see what’s out there
Try to not listen passively if you can, can diminish enjoyment
If you have to do limited time demos, listen to music you know and love over something that you only kinda know but is well recorded
You don’t have to listen extremely critically to get the benefits of a system
Quick switching generally won’t lead to any productive results, evaluate things slowly and allow yourself to acclimate and understand things to compare properly for both sides
Try to not get sucked into listening for one thing, listen as a whole and see what comes to you naturally
Things are seldom fact, and mainly opinions even if presented as fact
Sometimes it’s just not worth getting into arguments, best to respectfully disagree and move on, people get too wrapped up into that
There is no real absolute truth with audio despite what some may claim, most arguments have at least some merit, audio is not fully understood and is not easily explained
Different approaches can be equally valuable, there is not one “right” or “wrong” way to do things
Ignore reviewers once you have a setup you are satisfied with
If you can’t do that, make sure to find reviewers with opinions that align with your own
Don’t participate in communities that are too hive minded or circle jerky, typically won’t lead to much anything positive, it’s good to have alternate opinions and different takes from different perspectives
You don’t have to fully agree with someone to have an enjoyable discussion with someone, for some reason some don’t understand this
Treat people equally, should be common sense but feel like it’s not in some communities
Understand people can be in different situations and will experience things differently, try and consider that for some discussions
Watch out for people with ulterior motives for pushing or bashing something too much
Don’t only focus on the positive reviews, negative reviews or thoughts can provide more insight at times
Skimping on source gear will hurt you more and more as you go up
Synergy is pretty critical and again becomes more important as you go up
Different designs can be equally valuable, there is not one “right” or “wrong” way to do things
Don’t let the type of tech used dictate what you think, one is typically not overall better than the other, and they can vary on design
Implementation is everything
Nicer psu are rarely a bad upgrade
Better component quality is also rarely a bad upgrade
For higher end dacs, a better digital source through reclocking or streamers/transports/ddc can become pretty important
Measurements are independent from sound quality
Cables will make a difference, but to what extent really depends
Newer tech does not equal better, even with digital gear, but you might experience some issues with older or legacy hardware
Nothing is perfect, expect for some flaws and trade offs, just make sure you can live with those flaws and trade offs
For speaker the room is critical and can easily make or break a setup
Break in/Burn in/longer warm up periods are real and can impact things, to varying degrees depending on the device
Digital vs Analog, both can be great given they are equally matched. Digital is cheaper to get into and gives more bang for the buck in the lower end, but things even out as you continue to go up imo. A good analog setup is expensive though, but when it’s good, it’s real good
Power conditioning is hit or miss, all depends on your current setup, it’s a game of trade offs most of the time (as is everything else)
Tubes, while important in tube tech, can’t really fix a crappy amp, there’s more that goes into tube amps than just the tubes itself
I see this advice a lot and I honestly do agree with it in theory. But practically I find it hard to stick to. While I’m lucky to have a hifi store nearby, they’ve been reviewed as snobbish and I don’t really know about the brands they sell.
The other option is buy online and hope for a good return policy, but most of those return policies have some sort of restock or shipping fee. You then have to worry about break-in(mechanical and/or mental) in relation to the trial period and if the other gear you have is hurting your impression of it.
For example, if I upgrade speakers how would I know if my lower-grade amp is making the new speakers sound undesirable? What if I like the first speaker I try out? Do I return it and try another one anyways? If I upgrade gear and speakers at the same time the problem would be more confusing. This hobby takes patience I guess.
Exactly, this
Patience, and trial and error
Speaker in particular, once you hit a not throw away price point, you really want to try and hear them and ideally in your own environment.
But to even judge a single set of speakers you need a reference.
Good dealers really can be a god send here, there just isn’t another easy way to hear a variety.
I’m sorry if my post wasn’t clear. Sure “try before you buy” is ideal but its just not possible on all (or even most) gear lots of us want. More of what u meant is that experience gives you context. The more experience yoy have the more you are able to make sense of reviews and comments on gear.
Never reveal to your wife what you actually paid for your crap.
Man if I could just go to a dealer and say “hey I ain’t buyin shit but please setup at least 3 speakers for me?”, I would. The best I got is a vintage store running out of a printer store with Klipsch heresy 1’s overloading a tiny demo room.
I’ve had to use the phrase “you don’t wanna know” too often recently. Last time was for my cassette player and I only have 5 cassettes.
If you phrase it properly that could likely be done. Something like “I’m interested in a setup around this price point, I’m not exactly sure what I’m looking for right now, I’m considering xxxx speakers and xxxx source gear although that’s just what I’ve settled on after some research. Is there a way I could listen to some setups around that price range? I likely wouldn’t buy today, but I’d like to know what’s out there and go from there.” Although if you have a smaller dealer they might not really have that much aval to demo, so depends there
With a phrase like the above, you are laying down a desired budget, noting what you are interested in and potentially signalling the dealer to show you something that could be similar if they have heard or know about what gear you mention, asking to hear different types of setups, and putting it out there that you won’t buy today but might consider buying later.
One of the most important things I have learned is that it is worth it to save up and buy what you actually want. Too many times in the past I let price dictate my purchases. This ended up being a continuous loop of sidegrades and an extended stay in mid-fi hell. Ironically, those sidegrades end up costing more than the actual upgrades you had in mind but didn’t pursue due to price.
On the other side of things though, be realistic with yourself. 2 years with your own personal midfi setup far far outweighs 1 year 9 months with no hifi saving for a 6k setup.
Yeah maybe I’ll try to schmooze. I’d feel bad for making them work for nothing, and I recognize that my time demoing them will be a limited experience but maybe it would give me an idea of the ballpark I’d be working with in my price range? Be honest though, how long do you demo a speaker at a dealer before you feel awkward?
Luckily I can save up quick and my set up is already at a reasonably satisfactory level. Those XLS Encores I built do a damn good job for the money and effort.
This is the advice I always give people, but the crux of it is what you want, and determining that, endless side grades can be a good way to spend a lot of money that could have been used in a single upgrade.
But there is an element of fun in experimentation, cycling through some component on the used market can be a way to get a better understanding of what you like, it’s just not usually “free”, and at some point when you do step up there IME is always an element of regret for the amount of time and money and what if’s. But that really undervalues the actual entertainment value of the experience.
This is where ik at with LCD-R. When any possible upgrade is gravy above satisfaction you know you are in a good place
Any insight is better than no insight, and if you did find a setup you liked through a dealer, at times it actually might be a better deal to buy through them if they can give you a deal, so who knows. But yes if you don’t end up buying anything from them initially and feel bad about it, perhaps consider them if you need something else later on
Depends, if it’s for one setup, a few hours, after that it can get weird. But realistically the time frame tends to be an hour or two before it gets awkward unless you are switching things out or are super serious about buying from them. But for a casual demo a few hours
The staff get bored and often enjoy just talking gear or demoing stuff, as long as you’re not preventing them from selling something else, they mostly don’t care.
The Store I bought my first turntable from used to be in a student town, myself and a bunch of other broke students would buy upper entry level gear there, but we’d always chat with the staff, and we’d commonly demo gear that was orders of magnitude more than we would be likely to spend in the next decade. The staff knew that, but enjoyed the discussions.
Not every store is going to be so engaged with people wasting their time, but they are generally owned and staffed with enthusiasts, go have an honest conversation with them.