Active preamp shootout

Thanks for all the help! I’ve now started and have everything I need, the actual start of the thread is the 2nd post from there down!




Looking to put together a comparison of preamps, mainly in the high end to satisfy my own curiosity in my own systems, but also might borrow a few speakers and extra power amps for the sake of comparison if I can

What will be included so far:

High end:
Koda K15EX
Lamm LL1.1
FMA FM155MKIIR
Backert Labs Rhythm 1.2 or 1.3
Placette Active Linestage

And looking for suggestions for 1-2 other things to compare in this range

Lower end:
Atma-sphere MP-3 MK3.3
Coincident Statement MKII
Audible Illusions Modulus 3B
AVA FET Valve CF
Quicksilver Linestage

And also looking for a few suggestions to consider as well (probably more likely to entertain a wider range of stuff here)

Right away I can’t easily get a hold of any AC stuff as much as I want to so can’t do that, not interested in comparing anything from Pass either.

Speaker and source wise I’ll be using:

Dacs: berkeley, totaldac, lampizator, and mojo with my typical digital frontends, think that’s enough to get a good enough gauge on things. Could try and get another one for the sake of the comparison but I think I’m not super interested in doing that admittedly, I guess I should also include a bit less high end dacs to make the lower end comparison more fair

Amps: riviera, wavac, lamm, and also will be borrowing some other power amps but I’ll have to see what’s feasible for me to get my hands on, probably looking for some lower end

Cables: for the sake of my sanity I’ll only be using purist and audience and whatever I already use in my setups

Speakers: what I have now + a few other bookshelves depending on what I can get

Why: you’ll notice that this is already stuff I’ve already heard for the most part, but stuff I want to revisit now that I have proper setups to judge and I feel as though I have more 2ch experience. But I also would be interested in trying some new stuff to see how it holds up as well if possible too. But not much more than that, just for my own curiosity.

Why no passives? Because I think passives end up falling flat for the most part in the high end for me in most cases, but I could entertain adding one depending on what it is.

Don’t know how long it will take comparison wise, but hopefully at least by the end of the year preferably sooner lol

Any suggestions on what specifically to try and other suggestions on what tests to consider for them would be appreciated. Don’t plan to make this a longer drawn out thing, don’t plan to make this an article either

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The Beginning:

I LIED! It’s not a shootout. Why? Because fuck you that’s why. Really though, it’s because it took much longer than I thought, I was much more emotionally invested in some aspects of it rather than others, and because I don’t think it would end up a very fair result or an accurate representation of how I felt about each piece. So the format of a shootout wouldn’t work in the end. It’s also because I don’t feel as though I have enough personal experience (with both 2ch and preamps) to really confidently do a detailed comparison like I have done with DACs. This has been a weird one for me. It’s been much more of a pain in the ass, and really fruitless endeavor compared to my DAC comparisons, but still interesting nonetheless. It’s going to be filled with a bunch of dumb shit that makes me chuckle while writing it, because I don’t think I could bring myself to do it otherwise.

I’m going to try to be pretty simple and reasonably brief on this one. Please don’t take this as a “state of the preamp market” or whatever else, because it’s just stuff that I’ve liked in the past, cherry picked essentially, tested again in my current setups (+ some extras to satiate curiosity) just to really see if I can get a feel of what preamps really do in a setup, how to properly pair them, and what still holds up from what I remember liking. Perhaps I’m missing out on some new hotness or older legends because of this. I don’t really care. Not really my goal to try and find a new preamp for myself or someone else, just interested in revisiting some old favorites and a few new ones as well, learning for myself. Here is what I’m going to do:

  • Sort the preamps into an arbitrary respective performance category (hmmm reminds me of something)
  • Talk about my thoughts on the most impressive and least impressive pairing
  • Give a general overview of my experiences and takeaways
  • Maybe I’ll do a very brief comparison so the title isn’t a complete lie?

That’s about it. Still interested? Not sure why you would be, but great. Warning in advance, the cheap stuff is BORING. Seriously, it’s really a drag in comparison to the higher end stuff, and that’s likely really colored my opinion on it. Sure, there’s decent to be had in that range, but it’s nothing compared to really what’s above. One of the few categories of product where jumping as high as you can go is really worthwhile imo. But perhaps I’d feel differently if I hadn’t heard how important the pre can be and only lived with lower end gear never hearing anything higher.

Fuck You Level:

All of these are a middle finger to everything you’ve ever heard, some of them cutting deeper than others. They’re just better. They know they’re better. And they know you can do nothing but bask in their excellence.

  • Robert Koda Takumi K15EX
  • Lamm Industries LL1.1 Signature
  • AC Impera II Sig
  • CH Precision L1 + X1
  • Ayre KX-R Twenty

Fuck Me Level:

More kindhearted than the aforementioned, they’ll destroy what you expect out of a preamp, but in an inoffensive and more understated way. Lovingly fucked. Not as much as the previous, but still to an amount where this is where most would want to end up. More palatable price points too.

  • Allnic L-7000 w/ Constant Impedance & L-9000 (mini comparison)
  • FM Acoustics FM155MKIIR
  • Audio Research Corporation REF 6SE
  • VTL TL7.5 Series 3
  • Backert Labs Rhythm 1.3

Nice Place To Be:

Yeah, these are nice. What, expecting more out of this one?

  • LTA MicroZOTL Preamp Level 2
  • Atma-sphere MP-3 MK3.3 w/ V-CAP upgrades
  • Coincident Statement Linestage MKIII
  • Audible Illusions Modulus 3B
  • Pass XP-12

Not as nice of a place to be (but it’s still good right?):

The sonic equivalent of “Wow, nice place you have here.” There might be one or two things that somewhat impress you, but is it really where you want to be? Might be fooling yourself a bit wanting to stay.

  • Modwright SWL 9.0 AE
  • Rogue RP-5
  • Horne Shoppe The Truth
  • AVA FET Valve CF
  • Quicksilver Linestage

Why did I pick these? Because I already heard and liked them, most of them at least. And it’s a reasonable amount of variety. I decided since there’s little worth talking about things I didn’t like or thought was mediocre, I’ll just stick to what I know I liked in various demos or setups of the past, and see if they still hold up now. The only potential case where I’d want to use my findings to guide a future decision is if one of them replaces what I already have know, or if it does something that I don’t fully understand yet. There might be one or two of those cases here, but I’ll get to that later. I’m not going to have all of these in all at once (can’t make that work scheduling wise, can’t afford to make that work right now lol), so been working on them in category chunks.

Testing Equipment:

For this case, I’ll keep source chains consistent component and cable wise for what I think sounds good. Some of these chains will be reusing some stuff from others as I swap things around, I just put together what I liked with what I had on hand lol. So not going to swap around tubes, cables, sources, etc outside of the chunks of chain themselves. For my sanity at least. So if I’m using lets say the Horizon, it’s going to only be in the configuration and frontend specified. Yes I know some of the cabling or sources might be overkill for some of the amps and dacs, but I’m just using what I thought was the best sounding combo on hand. Also not going to mess with iso stuff since I’ve been moving everything around a lot, sorry about that as well.

Why did I pick this gear? Either I already have it, I’m comfortable with it, and/or I think it represents a different challenge or pairing demands/needs that would add value to be showcased. It’s not perfect, there’s some things I’d want to try to show more contrast, or because I think there would be strong synergy, but this is what I could get my hands on, and what I was willing to personally drop time (and in most cases also money) into for the test. I really don’t want to have to buy or ask for stuff I really don’t like, that only fills a very niche use case, or is a real hassle to procure lol.

Digital Frontends:

  • Totaldac d1-sublime w/ (and w/o) d1-drivers, live powers
    ◦ UpTone EtherRegen w/ Mojo Illuminati V3 → Totaldac d1-switch → Antipodes K50 AES (Squeeze)
    ‎‎▪ Esprit Aura RJ45, Echole Limited Edition AES, Purist Dominus Diamond Power (for DAC & K50), TWL Obsession (for network gear)
  • Lampizator Horizon
    ◦ Sonore opticalModule Deluxe w/ Mojo Illuminati V3 → Sonore Signature Rendu SE optical Tier II → Ideon Absolute Time
    ◦ Takatsuki 274B, Brimar CV1988 Black Glass, Tung-Sol KT170
    :black_small_square: FTA Sinope USB, Audience FrontRow HP Power (for DAC & Absolute Time), TWL Obession (for Sonore)
  • Berkeley Alpha Reference 3
    ◦ Sonore opticalModule Deluxe w/ Mojo Illuminati V3 → Sonore Signature Rendu SE optical Tier II → Berkeley Alpha USB
    :black_small_square: Audience FrontRow USB, Tara Labs RSC Air Evolution AES, Audience FrontRow Power (for DAC), TWL Obsession (for Sonore & Alpha USB)
  • Mojo Mystique EVO Pro 21
    ◦ Sonore opticalModule Deluxe w/ Mojo Illuminati V3 → Sonore Signature Rendu SE optical Tier II → Berkeley Alpha USB
    :black_small_square: Audience FrontRow USB, Tara Labs RSC Air Evolution AES, Audience FrontRow Power (for DAC), TWL Obsession (for Sonore & Alpha USB)
  • Crane Song Solaris Quantum
    ◦ Sonore opticalModule Deluxe w/ Mojo Illuminati V3 → Sonore Signature Rendu SE optical Tier II
    :black_small_square: FTA Sinope USB, TWL Obsession Power
  • Soekris DAC2541
    ◦ PI2AES w/ SGC LPS
    :black_small_square: Snake River Boomslang AES
  • OG Schiit Bifrost 2
    ◦ Allo USBridge Signature Player w/ SGC LPS
    :black_small_square: TWL Passion USB

Analog Backends:

  • Riviera AFM-50 → Borresen 01 & Spatial Audio X5
    ◦ Siemens 5814 Triple Mica, Audience FrontRow HP Power
  • Aries Cerat Concero 25 → Voxativ PI 2 AC4X, Dynaudio Special 40
    ◦ Elrog ER845, Audience FrontRow HP Power
  • Parasound JC1+ → Borresen 01 & ATC SCM19v2
    ◦ TWL Obsession Power
  • Yamamoto Sound Craft A-08S → Voxativ PI 2 AC4X & Omega Compact Alnico
    ◦ EML Mesh 45, Western Electric 717-A, RCA 80, Audience FrontRow HP Power
  • Quicksilver Mid Monos → Dynaudio Special 40 & Spatial Audio X5
    ◦ Mazda 12AX7 Long Plate, Siemens 6922 A, Mullard EL34, Audience FrontRow HP Power
  • First Watt F8 → Spatial Audio X5 & Omega Compact Alnico
    ◦ TWL Obession Power
  • JOB 225 → ATC SCM19v2 & SVS Ultra Bookshelf
    ◦ Purist Dominus Diamond Power

Brief Headphone Section:

  • Eddie Current Studio T → Focal Utopia & Mysphere 3.1
    ◦ Danacable Lazuli Nirvana, Custom Silver Cable
  • Mass Kobo 394 II → Mysphere 3.2 & Final D8000 Pro
    ◦ Kimber Axios Hybrid, Brise Mikumari Ref. 2
  • Riviera AFM 50 → Hifiman Susvara, Mysphere 3.2
    ◦ DHC Prion4 taps, Kimber Axios Hybrid + Kimber taps
  • Aries Cerat Concero 25 → Hifiman Susvara, Mysphere 3.1
    ◦ DHC Prion4 taps, Custom cable

Analog Interconnect Options (RCA & XLR):

  • Audience FrontRow
  • Purist Dominus Luminist
  • Cardas Clear Beyond
  • Snake River Signature

My Patience:


This is going to take awhile, it’s been taking awhile, I’ve been sort of working on this idea since the beginning of the year. Expect it to be mostly done by the end of the year. I’ve had a ton of things happen this year that I’ve had to deal with that have really removed a decent bit of my time and desire to listen, and I’ve had to rearrange and reconfigure my setups many times, and I’m sorting to get sick of a lot of it. So expect a slightly more bitter take on things than normal at times. This isn’t to say I’m going to compromise potential accuracy or be unfair, potentially a bit lazy though at times, and I’ll likely have stronger feelings on things that I really end up liking and disliking than normal. But oh well, already said this isn’t going to be as structured and throughout as others, and not even really a comparison lol. Comes with all the caveats + more that I’m too lazy to write, this isn’t really going to be public so I feel ok ish skipping over a lot of the disclaimers since most here know what problems come with stuff like this lol. See ya’ll later, doing the boring chunk first to get that out of the way

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The (mostly) Boring:

The Shit:

The Wrap Up:




Bonus Cheaper Passive Section:

So I was dicking around with all the passive preamps I have, and I’ll just get to the point, the axiom ii walker mod is the best passive I’ve heard under 1k. I’ve got both a balanced and single ended version, and they’re both the consistently least flat sounding pot in a box passive I’ve heard in the price range, and that’s really it’s biggest strength, it’s more direct/immediate and lively sounding than one of the other ones I like the goldpoint sa2x (though that’s still good). Don’t get me wrong, it doesn’t really compare to a good active, but it beats a lot of sub 1k new active preamps in a lot of aspects as long as you don’t feed it a really low level input and are willing to sacrifice a bit of body/heft and engagement potentially. Only other passive at that price point that I remember being as like this was the lightspeed attenuator, but it’s been too long to comment on that one, but I’d still highly recommend it based on past experience.

If you really want something different in the sub 1k passive space, while I’ve not heard too many tvc, the promitheus reference tvc is still something I pull out when I want to just have a really unique sounding preamp for the price. It’s seriously colored, but it can work well in systems still imo. It really gives you the character, richness, dynamics, and organicness and sort of avoids the flatness and dryness that a lot of passives have. That being said, it really does limit what happens on both edges of the spectrum, smooths over things a bit, and the coloration is really hit or miss depending on the chain. It’s hard to describe since some of the resolving power, directness, and extension deficiencies are pretty clear in comparison to let’s say the axiom, it just sounds more fleshed out and engaging, and there’s absolutely some value in that, and makes the axiom feel really just boring. This is actually a great example of how a lot of the time a “tubey” character that people like to point to can come more from transformers than tubes lol. Always mixed on it, because on one hand it feels limiting, on another it’s something that I always end up being surprised of how it’s almost a middleground of a passive and active in what it does well

I’ve tried a lot of other passive preamps in this price range, and most of them aren’t really noteworthy, they do the job, and fine enough for lower end setups but show the limitations in the high end, these were the few standouts for me, but I’m not super experienced in the preamp realm. If you just need a cheap pot in a box for a budget setup, something like the palmer monicon or schiit sys work well nicely. For something more midrange I also think the pine tree sp1 or bellari pp532 is nice for the price for a somewhat upgrade from the sys. Although at these under 300 ish range passives, you could likely diy something more impressive sounding for much better value. Otherwise I’d just save more for the above if you care about overall quality and aren’t looking for a cheap bandaid/problem solver

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An offering from Pass labs I think would fit in nicely, something with the dual chassis design. You know, to be rid of the tube curse?

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I second this, though I believe you’ve owned one previously. An XS would be awesome to see included.

LTA could be nice to see as well.

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Hell yeah. Really looking forward to reading this in the future. Let me know if you want any ideas, input, or feedback

Not really interested tbh. Also, most of the best preamps are tube, a lot of solid state pre either suck or are mediocre in comparison imo, already struggled enough thinking of ss pre I actually liked enough to justify picking up again or borrowing for the comparison, but I can look at see what other solid state options are out there.

In regards to why no pass, I think it wouldn’t compete well, and they’re boring sounding (in comparison to a lot of the stuff listed) imo

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How about the Supratek offerings? I have been curious about the Cabernet DHT but don’t have a good use case right now.

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Here’s my shortlist of preamps if you have access to them:

Trafomatic head 2
Modwright KWA 150 SE
Arc Reference 5
Manley Neo Classic 300B
Allnic L1500

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No experience, looks pretty cool though, will note it down

Oh I should get an allnic in, skipping the head2 since it’s mainly a headphone amp and want to focus on mostly preamp focused designs, I’ll look into the modwright, something from arc, and manley

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No Riviera? The APL10?

Mola Mola Makua!

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I don’t really know if I can get ahold of that one, but it’s one of those I wanted to try at some point

Will consider it, although a bit hesitant

@Rmsanger I could more easily get my hands on a L8000 DHT or L9000 if I wanted to for the high end section, or are you looking at more of their lower end ones? In that case the cheapest allnic pre I can easily get would likely be a L6500

I could also easily get an arc reference 6se if that would be close enough for you (or a ref 10)

Being honest, I don’t really know if I want to get any modwright stuff in since I don’t have an easy way, and they drop in value real fast if I have to buy new and sell used

I could prob get my hands on a manley 300b but haven’t checked yet

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Cost has to be a consideration in the ranking here or are you simply going for performance? There such a wide range dollar delta in the high end. I considered a Backert Labs pre because they’re attainable even as a new purchase. The fact that they’re made practically in my back yard is also nice, but it’s a quarter of the cost of some of the others on your high end list.

How about Burmester?

Edit:
I think it’s cool that the 808 is modular and has been in production for so long.

Shindo Labs has at least 3 modern full range pre-amplifiers I’ve lusted over. Beautiful pieces. Pretty much anything boutique coming out of Japan has my interest. You have the category covered but i figured i would throw Shindo Labs in the mix on the off chance you run across one :+1:

Bit of both

And they perform just as well if not better in other cases, serious value there if they match your setup lol

Will look into it, I don’t know if I know any dealers who have burmester so I’ll check

That modular ability is pretty neat on the 808

Ah yes shindo lol, so here’s the thing, I was under the impression that you basically go all shindo or no shindo, so was a bit worried that a preamp would be lackluster on it’s own and only shine with a shindo power amp, but I’ll have to see if there’s a way I could get one loaned

Should put in the LTA pre, see if I can get one of those

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Always interested in the Allnic stuff. It would be great if you could get their in house tubes as well. That’d be sweet!

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Looking forward to this. How about a Bricasti M20? Holo serene is popular but that’s on the cheaper end of things at least amongst what you will be comparing.

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